Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Janne Grimholt

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. The keep !votes lean heavily on WP:OTHERSTUFF and speculation about what a nonexistent SNG for handballers would say. The existing notability criteria for sportspeople are arbitrary enough; let's not start imagining new ones. – Joe (talk) 16:24, 28 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Janne Grimholt (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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Not sufficiently notable competitor of a predominantly amateur sport. Geschichte (talk) 21:12, 5 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. ^Thanks, L3X1 ◊distænt write◊ 22:41, 5 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. ^Thanks, L3X1 ◊distænt write◊ 22:41, 5 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Norway-related deletion discussions. ^Thanks, L3X1 ◊distænt write◊ 22:41, 5 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete - Unable to establish notability in a search for reliable sources. Appears to fail WP:GNG. Red Phoenix ^talk 05:17, 6 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]
• Neutral - I have no idea how you can say handball is an amateur sport. It's the second biggest team sport in Europe by the way. But I agree that three is not a big relevance for the article. But there is a small notability because she played at the EHF Cup Winners' Cup which was the third most importance club competition in Europe.--Malo95 (talk) 08:27, 6 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• It might be professional in Denmark, Germany, France, Spain and some Eastern European countries. But not in Norway and most other countries, and especially not for women. Geschichte (talk) 19:55, 10 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep - She have played several matches in Norways highest professional handball league Eliteserien (altomfootball.no). Isn't that good enough? --Trade (talk) 15:43, 6 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• It's not professional, not even close. Geschichte (talk) 19:55, 10 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete non-biographies like this do no one any good.John Pack Lambert (talk) 19:47, 8 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment non-biographies? Trade (talk) 21:06, 8 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment We need to discuss the rules when it comes to the notability for handball players. Despite the large amount of biographies WP:ATHLETE does not mention anything about handball. --Trade (talk) 14:15, 13 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Answer I twice tried to make a guideline but nobody answered to me. So I gave it up. --Malo95 (talk) 16:07, 17 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Basic Criteria WP:SPORTBASIC sets out some basic criteria that seem to lie somewhere between WP:GNG and WP:NORG in severity, the key component is requiring multiple sources instead of usually requiring them. It also suggests likely criteria that would indicate notability, but in lieu of specific sport rules, they are just that - suggestions. Nosebagbear (talk) 10:31, 20 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

What do you think about the guidelines suggested by Malo95? --Trade (talk) 11:26, 20 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Seems reasonable, but as someone who knows little about the sport I can't say if anything obvious is missing Nosebagbear (talk) 11:39, 20 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep was a frequent winner of the national cup and participant in the EHF Cup Winners' Cup. A former international in Norway's U21. No shortage of WP:SIGCOV either. gidonb (talk) 20:11, 21 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]
• Criteria Again - Malo95 I assume there are probably some semi-professional leagues, perhaps some intermediate point for them, such as won tournament or some variant? Nosebagbear (talk) 20:29, 21 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment As i've said before, Grimholt have played dozens of matches in Eliteserien. But for some reason, Geschichte doesn't think it that counts. --Trade (talk) 12:17, 26 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete Sources consist of links to pages of individual statistics and two articles mentioning her moving from her team in Norway to one in Spain. Hard to say that constitutes sufficient coverage to meet WP:GNG. As for WP:NSPORT, the basic criteria for any sport is playing at the highest level. Since she has never competed at a world championship or Olympics, this standard is not met. In fact, she has never played for the Norwegian national adult women's team and success as a junior is usually not considered sufficient for notability. Papaursa (talk) 17:30, 22 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

That is very aggressive reading of the basic criteria - they actually note that those who have performed at the highest level are likely to meet the notability criteria. That does not give a strict rule to the opposite Nosebagbear (talk) 20:27, 22 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I would say my interpretation is reasonable (and typical), not aggressive. My point is that she doesn't meet the SNG for sportspeople. That doesn't mean she can't be notable, it just means that WP:GNG is the criteria she needs to meet. I don't think articles about her changing teams are enough to do that. Papaursa (talk) 20:50, 22 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. Local/regional coverage about her single season for Spanish BM Remudas, little coverage about her years in Gjerpen IF. Fails WP:GNG/WP:BASIC, which is what WP:SPORTBASIC roughly translates to. Sam Sailor 16:45, 24 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment Papaursa, we already have dozens if not hundreds of handball biographies like this one. It doesn't make any sense to single this particular person out. --Trade (talk) 12:17, 26 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The fact that WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is not a valid reason to keep this article. The relevant issue is whether or not this person meets any notability criteria and she doesn't appear to. None of the keep votes have shown evidence of a valid reason for keeping this article. If you don't want her singled out, feel free to nominate the other handball biographies you believe are equivalent. Papaursa (talk) 03:06, 28 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.