Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hotel Kurrajong Heights - Modern Residential to Cost £25,000

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Well that was an interesting one! ~ Amory (u • t • c) 02:42, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hotel Kurrajong Heights - Modern Residential to Cost £25,000

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Appears to be a wholesale copy-paste of a news article from 1926 with no claim to encyclopedic notability. Madg2011 (talk) 04:24, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

REPLY - None of the content available on Trove is mere copy and paste.

In Trove's About Page https://trove.nla.gov.au/general/about (and verified by me during a telephone call to The National Library of Australia +61 02 6262-1266) it states:

About Trove Trove helps you find and use resources relating to Australia. It's more than a search engine. Trove brings together content from libraries, museums, archives, repositories and other research and collecting organisations big and small. A list of contributors and partners whose collections are included in Trove can be viewed online.

Trove's origins can be traced back to a project launched by the National Library of Australia in August 2008. Its aim was to build a portal for all of the Library’s online discovery services, including the Register of Australian Archives and Manuscripts, Picture Australia, Libraries Australia, Music Australia, Australia Dancing, PANDORA web archive, ARROW Discovery Service and the Australian Newspapers Beta service.

Today Trove is transformed, growing far beyond its original purpose and becoming many things to many people: a community, a set of services, an aggregation of metadata, and a growing repository of full text digital resources. Trove is a platform on which new knowledge is being built. It is a collaboration between the National Library, Australia's State and Territory libraries and hundreds of cultural and research institutions around Australia, working together to create a legacy of Australia’s knowledge for now and into the future.

Best of all, Trove is yours. As you text correct, comment, tag or contribute content you are helping to build a better service for everyone.

During my telephone conversation with the Librarian he was interested to hear that I intended to use the newspaper clippings for inclusion in Wikipedia. He said that as long as I credited The National Library of Australia I was allowed to use any newspaper scan before 1950 as they were out of copyright and now in the Public Domain.

This article (and hopefully many more) will form a part of the MAIN Wiki page I am constructing called [Kurrajong Heights Hotel] that is in Draft at the moment.

Here is a link to the condition of this article in Trove https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/85956118

Will I have to go through this for every news clipping I add to Wikipedia?

User:Southern Armada — Preceding unsigned comment added by Southern Armada (talk • contribs) 06:59, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Please don't add any news clippings to Wikipedia. Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia, not a newspaper archive. You can link to pages on other websites (see WP:REF), but please don't just copy things like this. It's not what Wikipedia is all about. Please also note (re: Draft:Kurrajong Heights Hotel) that we don't write articles as a sequence of quotes from newspapers. Again, that's not how encyclopaedias are written. Use your own words and cite the sources; don't just copy from elsewhere (except very sparingly when a direct quote really is appropriate). -- Necrothesp (talk) 08:51, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia, not a newspaper archive. - Indeed, Trove is the newspaper archive. We don't need to mirror it here. --AussieLegend (✉) 10:34, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Architecture-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 07:39, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 07:39, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 07:39, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. WP:NOTNEWSPAPER. Ajf773 (talk) 08:08, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. This. Is. Not. An. Encyclopaedia. Article! -- Necrothesp (talk) 08:51, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom, and per the two editors above. While this appears to have been created in very good faith as part of creating an article, Wikipedia entries need to be encyclopedic content. Trove does a great job of preserving material like this, and should be used as the reference for the article - there's no need to bring references 'in house' by copying their text into Wikipedia as was the intention here. Southern Amada, you might find Help:Referencing for beginners useful. Nick-D (talk) 09:50, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Agree as nom. Didn't mean to WP:BITE the newcomer - certainly seems like the article was created in good faith. Madg2011 (talk) 15:14, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

This article is not on the internet unless I put it there. Therefore it cannot be cited. The scans on Trove are barely readable and when a person (as I do) corrects the scan it is still not in a presentable form. Did anyone check my source? https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/85956118 In bringing the existence of the Kurrajong Heights Hotel to the internet (as there is nothing now) it will be preserved. And preserving the journalistic jargon of the time is worthy of keeping, not my grammatical version of what happened so many years ago. I have even created an image of the headlines to preserve that historical feel. Southern Armada (talk) 10:08, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- But Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a repository of news stories and the like. Trove welcomes reader-generated corrections to the automatically scanned text (which appears in the column at the left of the page), and has a large community of volunteers who do this (details of how to participate are available here). If the Trove scan and its automatically generated text aren't useful, I'd suggest that you correct it. Nick-D (talk) 10:33, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - This article is not on the internet unless I put it there - Trove is on the internet, the article is on Trove so therefore the article is on the internet. I just noticed that you created Draft:Kurrajong Heights Hotel. If you really want to use the Trove source you don't need to duplicate it as a separate article. Just use the pertinent facts and cite trove in Draft:Kurrajong Heights Hotel. --AussieLegend (✉) 10:37, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Delete No evidence of notability and WP:NOTNEWSPAPER applies. --AussieLegend (✉) 10:37, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe you do not understand Trove - It is unsearchable by any search engine such as google. Therefore, unless the general public is acquainted with Trove and is willing to try reading fractured scan text or try and read the actual newspaper print then none of it will be found. Trove is a tool to make the text available to developers not a publishing platform. This is something that I am attempting to do by collating the only available recorded history of the Kurrajong Heights Hotel into one place while retaining the look and feel of the grammar of the period. I am NOT trying to make Wikipedia a repository of news stories, I and trying to record the history of the Kurrajong Heights Hotel Southern Armada (talk) 15:17, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Southern Armada - there are a wide variety of Wikipedia citation templates that can, I assure you, accommodate news archives like Trove. It's not necessary, and against the rules of Wikipedia, to create an article consisting solely of primary-source material to serve as a reference for another article. Madg2011 (talk) 15:18, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Southern Armada - I think you'll find that most people here understand Trove. We've been using it for ages. As Madg2011 said, it's against the rules of Wikipedia to create an article consisting solely of primary source material. As I said above, the correct method of using Trove material is to write an article, preferably in your own words, and to cite trove from your article. --AussieLegend (✉) 18:09, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Can someone point me towards these citation templates that accommodate news archives? I cannot find them. Southern Armada (talk) 03:13, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Southern Armada This is not the place to do so but tomorrow I will put a message on the talk page of your Kurrajong Heights Hotel draft to show you how to simply cite from Trove. JennyOz (talk) 10:06, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Very strong delete. The subject of the article, in its current form, is a newspaper article. Said newspaper article itself totally fails WP:GNG. There are no critical works written about the newspaper article. Accordingly, it is an unsuitable topic for Wikipedia. (Whether the text of the article is free and can be used on Wikisource is an entirely separate issue.) —C.Fred (talk) 03:17, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Delete unfortunately. Southern Armada you have put in a lot of work but unfortunately it is just not in the form of a wikipedia article. Please take heed of the advice and comments already offered by others above and keep on editing in wikipedia. We need editors like you who have an in-depth interest in subjects and can create content. Aoziwe (talk) 07:28, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Per WP:TNT in current form.Icewhiz (talk) 13:40, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.