Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Tyrone Garland/archive2

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Graham Beards via FACBot (talk) 15:54, 22 October 2015 [1].

Tyrone Garland

Nominator(s): TempleM (talk) 22:05, 1 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about a professional basketball player who last played with the Mississauga Power in Canada. He made history at John Bartram High School in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, coming close to Wilt Chamberlain on the Philadelphia Public League all-time scoring list. He also made one of the biggest plays of the 2013 NCAA Tournament in college after initial struggles. This article is detailed in its coverage of this player and cites nearly every reliable source that I could find on the Internet about the subject. It was promoted to GA-class on June 21 of this year. This is the second time this article is being nominated for FA...the first time it didn't receive enough support. TempleM (talk) 22:05, 1 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Jaguar

After reading it for a third time, I'm going to go ahead and support this nomination. It is well written, very comprehensive and well referenced, all in all meeting the FA criteria. I haven't had time to spotcheck the article's sources (I don't feel qualified to give a full source check, but I'm sure it will come along later in the review), but after I reviewed the GAN, I've realised that this article has kept its level of professionalism. Well done. I did find a few things I thought I should mention though, so I'll note them below. JAGUAR  19:31, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • Be careful about the tight squeeze of text in the Junior sub-section. Usually it's discouraged on FA-levels
I have resized the image. If you feel like it is unnecessary, I am fine with removing it, though. TempleM (talk) 21:30, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "The move ended Garland's stint with Mississauga" - I didn't know what this means, is "stint" informal?
"Stint" means the time a person spent doing something, in this case playing for the Power. I do not believe it is informal. TempleM (talk) 21:30, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "As a freshman at the Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University" - link freshman?
Done. TempleM (talk) 21:30, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "In late December, it was released that he was heading back to Philadelphia" - December of 2011?
Fixed. TempleM (talk) 21:30, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I see no glaring problems with the article. It is well-written, comprehensive, blah blah blah. I did do some minor copyedititing, so I think the prose is a bit better (though it was already pretty solid to begin with). My onlly minor quibble is that I don't know if AAU should be an individual section since it isn't with any other basketball articles, but this might not even be a problem. ~EDDY (talk/contribs)~ 14:57, 3 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Editorofthewiki: Since you mentioned it, do you have any ideas on where to put the AAU section information if it is removed? TempleM (talk) 17:26, 6 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I wasn't suggesting you remove it, I was suggesting you incorporate it in the high school section. But like I said, it's no big deal. The article is splendid. ~EDDY (talk/contribs)~ 17:37, 6 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Images are appropriately licensed and captioned. Nikkimaria (talk) 15:33, 4 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Cirt

  • Comment (having stumbled here from my FAC). There's a cite in the lede that doesn't need to be there, as long as same material is cited later on in body text of article. There's a bit too much use of quotes in places in the article where they could be trimmed and/or paraphrased, instead. Those are the only major issues I could see. — Cirt (talk) 00:52, 30 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Cirt: The cited information in the lead is not included anywhere else (as it doesn't belong), so I think the citation could remain there. I paraphrased one quote in the "early life" section, but I am not sure about the others. TempleM (talk) 23:16, 30 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I've never really seen that before where cited info in the lede doesn't appear later on. Per WP:LEAD, it should. Suggest finding a way to work that cited info into the body text. After that, I'd probably be ready to switch. — Cirt (talk) 23:22, 30 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Cirt: I removed the citation from the lead, because his "shooting guard qualities" are mentioned elsewhere in the article (first section of "Collegiate career"). This info is cited. TempleM (talk) 00:17, 3 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. Thanks for being responsive to my comments, above. — Cirt (talk) 00:23, 3 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Coemgenus

Lede
  • "... he decided to transfer to La Salle..." would be better as "...he transferred to La Salle...", since the transferring, rather than the decision to transfer, is what's important here.
Early life and high school
  • "He grew up on South Yewdall Street, which was situated near 54th Street and Greenway Avenue." would be more informative as "He grew up on South Yewdall Street, near 54th Street and Greenway Avenue in Southwest Philadelphia's Kingsessing neighborhood."
  • "Donnel Feaster, an alum" "alum" is kind of informal. I'd say "alumnus".
  • "Amauro Austin, a statistician for the Philadelphia Daily News, directed the program while he was there." The final "he" refers to Garland, right? If so, you should change it to Garland, because right now the antecedent is Austin.
Collegiate career
  • " He made the decision to attend the school at a press conference..." More likely he announced the decision at a press conference, right?
  • "Garland had also considered joining programs like..." Using "like" suggests that there was a larger list of schools that are typified by the ones you list. I think what you mean to say is "Garland had also considered joining programs, including..."
  • "Garland weighed approximately 170 lbs (77 kg) entering college, and was not as highly-rated as some of the team's 2010 recruits, like Jarell Eddie, because of his shooting guard qualities." This is a little confusing. Whose shooting guard qualities are we talking about here. And what, exactly, were those qualities?
  • Also, in the sentence above, "highly rated" does not require a hyphen.
  • "...seeing one minute of playing time on the court throughout the game ..." could lose "throughout the game" without changing the meaning of the sentence.
  • "He was allowed to play 24 minutes throughout the game..." could be "He played 24 minutes in the game..."
  • "In late December of 2011, it was announced that he was heading back to Philadelphia to compete for La Salle." Again, this makes the announcement the focus of the sentence, not the transfer. Perhaps "In late December 2011, Garland returned to Philadelphia to compete for La Salle."
  • "...because he was ineligible due to NCAA regulations." Maybe add "regarding player transfers" to the end of that sentence, for people who might be unfamiliar with NCAA regs on such things (and to make it clear that he wasn't academically ineligible.)
Professional career
  • "In late June 2015, it was announced that the Mississauga Power had folded due to the creation of..." works better as "In late June 2015, the Mississauga Power folded after the creation of..."
  • "The move ended Garland's stint with Mississauga." Is he a free agent now?
  • That's all I have. I look forward to your responses. --Coemgenus (talk) 20:40, 1 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Coemgenus: I have addressed the points that you brought up. I am not sure whether Garland is officially considered a "free agent," as I cannot find any sources that directly state that, so it is best to leave that alone. TempleM (talk) 00:07, 2 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
That makes sense. The article looks great, and I'm happy to support. --Coemgenus (talk) 01:17, 2 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Mike Christie

  • "for whom he started competed"?
  • James Brown is named as head coach twice within a couple of sentences.
  • "Letter winner" won't mean anything to a non-U.S. reader; I'd link it at least, or explain it inline if not.
  • "which is sometimes regarded as one of his best performances" -- I don't see this in the source.
  • "Strongly due to" is ugly; maybe "Largely due to".
  • I'm a little doubtful that we need so much detail on his uneventful first couple of games in college; do other sports FAs go into this level of detail?
  • "Greenberg was inquired about" needs to be rephrased.
  • 'he that "you can't play 13 guys".'?
  • "in the past year" -- rephrase to make the year definite; I assume this is the academic, not calendar year?
  • You have two sentences at different places in the "Sophomore" section that say essentially the same thing: "Following his exams, he returned to his hometown of Philadelphia" and "In late December 2011, he returned to Philadelphia to compete for La Salle."

I'll try to finish this review tomorrow. I think the article needs a careful read through; it's not so much that it needs a copyedit, but some of the clumsinesses I point out above really should have been caught. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 02:33, 2 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Mike Christie: I have addressed the issues you pointed out. Please look over the article again and let me know if there are still any errors. TempleM (talk) 01:07, 3 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Also, regarding the "Freshman" section, I included information about his first few games (even though he hardly played in them) to make it clear to the reader that he had a very small role in that season. Nevertheless, I removed one unnecessary sentence concerning an insignificant game/performance. TempleM (talk) 01:11, 3 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I struck most of the points; I'll reread for the other point. I'll try to review the rest of the article today. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 13:55, 3 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Continuing the review:

  • "recommended that Garland attend his alma mater due to his basketball skill set": I'd cut "due to his basketball skill set". The only thing in the source that supports this is the quote from Brown, which you give in the next sentence.
  • "According to coach Giannini, he told the guard post-game": unneccessarily complicated. I'd just make this "After the game, Giannini told Garland"; I know this is as reported by Giannini, but it's not controversial and the details can be left in the source.
  • I think footnote [a] could be moved into the main text; it's useful information. I'd also suggest a final statement to the effect of "As of late 2015, Garland is not signed to any team" or "is actively looking for a new opportunity" or something to that effect, assuming you can source it.

-- Overall I think the article is FA quality, and I plan to support once these points are addressed. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 16:50, 4 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Mike Christie: I have addressed the three issues you brought up. Let me know if I still need to make fixes. TempleM (talk) 17:22, 4 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Support. All my concerns are addressed. Note to the coords: I found a couple of minor variations from what the source said -- nothing serious but a source spot check is probably a good idea. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 01:45, 5 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note - Yes, I agree that a spot check of the sources for accuracy and the absence of any close paraphrasing is needed on this occasion. Graham Beards (talk) 08:43, 5 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Mike Christie and Graham Beards: Is anyone willing to spot check the sources? TempleM (talk) 19:41, 10 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Cas Liber

I'll take a look. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:50, 18 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • "Southwest Philly Floater" is the term used in the source (FN1). Kingsessing not mentioned in source.
  • Earwig's looks ok - some quotes inflating the percentage...

More later - need to sleep (midnight here in Oz) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:58, 18 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Casliber: I've added a citation that mentions that Garland grew up in the Kingsessing neighborhood. TempleM (talk) 14:32, 18 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • FN 3 used 6 times - all good/faithful
  • FN 27 - source used 4 times , mostly good but I can't see this (In a seven minute stretch in the second half, Garland scored 14 straight points. He said after the game, "I used to do it in high school. It kind of felt like high school when I was out there; it just felt good") in the source...?
  • FN 30 used 2 times - all good/faithful
  • FN 43 used 6 times - all good/faithful

Overall, spot checking looknig alright with one query outstanding. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:14, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Casliber: I have added a source that includes the quote. TempleM (talk) 21:07, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Ok all good now. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:25, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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