Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/2016 World Snooker Championship/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 17 August 2022 [1].

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Nominator(s): Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 09:37, 2 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about the 2016 edition of the World Snooker Championship. Mark Selby won the event defeating Ding Junhui in the final. Let me know your thoughts.Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 09:37, 2 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Image review—pass (t · c) buidhe 17:21, 2 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Recusing to review. I will do a little copy editing as I go. Let me know if you object to anything.

• What is a "ranking event"?
  • It's an event that carries snooker world rankings points. It's probably a bit difficult to spell that out without it being overly detailed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:45, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"The event was the tenth and last ranking event of the 2015–2016 season." → 'The event was the tenth and last event of the 2015–2016 season that carried snooker world ranking points' doesn't seem difficult to me.

Apologies GTM, I've been a bit busy with something else. Sure, I've made this change. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 08:46, 16 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• "All the other players". Which group is made up of who?
  • Added to summary. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:51, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "to within one at 10–9." Missing word?
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:51, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "210 million viewers from China on CCTV-5 in China." I don't think we need both "from China" and "in China."
  • Indeed. I've changed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:51, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Why is the text on qualifying not in chronological order? Ie, before the text on the first round.
  • This is pretty standard - I have asked in the past, but currently there is no consensus to have qualification before the main draw. Probably as it's much less important and can be quite long on these pages. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:51, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I am not referring to the rather smart graphics. You write about qualifying in some detail in "Tournament summary#Seeding and qualifying rounds" and then repeat some of it and add information in "Qualifying". This level of detail would be better consolidated in one place, and just a brief summary left to introduce "Qualifying", as you do with "Main draw".

I get your concern. However, I do feel like it would bloat up the format section to include the names of invited players, for instance. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 08:48, 16 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Ho hum. I might be inclined to argue further over this, but checking other, similar, promoted articles this approach has clearly been acceptable to other reviewers. Which I find a little odd, but so be it. Otherwise well up to your usual standard. Gog the Mild (talk) 10:48, 16 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That's all I have. Nice work. Gog the Mild (talk) 19:49, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Gog the Mild. Thanks for the review! Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:51, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Try to avoid starting two consecutive sentences with "it" in the lead's first paragraph. Maybe the second one can be "The event was the tenth and last of the 2015–16 snooker season that carries ranking points."
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "The defending champion was Stuart Bingham" - Active voice if possible
  • Sorry, I'm not following Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• I'd do demonyms for both or neither in "China's Ding Junhui and Scot Alan McManus"
  • removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "Ding also setting a new record for [...]" - Shouldn't "setting" be "set"? Also there's two consecutive sentences starting with "Ding" so maybe just "he" in the second one.
  • We need to avoid "he", because we just spoke about two people, I've reworded. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "he announced his retirement later during the first round of the event" - "later" could be removed here as it is not completely necessary in my opinion, or "he announced his retirement later in the first round of the event"
  • reworded Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "raised to £1,500,100 from the previous year's £1,364,000" - maybe "raised to £1,500,100 from £1,364,000 the previous year"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "The semi-finals were played 28–30 April over four sessions" - "on" 28-30 April?
  • I've actually been told off for doing that previously. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• There's a problem with WP:OVERLINK in the article. I can count at least six instances of Ding Junhui in the article and a bunch of others (Bingham, maximum break, Allen, Maguire, McManus, Trump, Hawkins, 2011, Davis, Hendry, etc.)
  • doing Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:11, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "A total of 128 players competed in the qualifying" - maybe it's just me but this sounds incomplete. should there be a word after "qualifying"? like maybe "round".
  • Added "draw". Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:07, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• No alt texts?
  • added Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:11, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I was probably being a little nit-picky but that's all. Great work here as usual.--NØ 18:50, 20 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Overview

• "is the official world championship of the game of snooker" - add "professional" in there somewhere as there are IBSF and WWS versions too.
  • DOne Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Could wikilink "world snooker rankings" at first instance.
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "The first world championship was held in 1927 taking place in Camkin's Hall, Birmingham..." - how about "The first world championship was held in 1927 at Camkin's Hall, Birmingham..."?
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "modern era" - could do with an inline explanation or footnote.
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "This was Bingham's first championship.." - add a word like "win" or "title" after championship.
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "rolling 147 prize" - suggesting adding an inline explanation or footnote.
  • Removed rolling, just state what the prize was. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Tournament

• I don't think that players are consistently referred to, by surname or full name - what is the intention?
  • There's a couple people who share last names with high-profile snooker players (Higgins, Davis, etc) and someone like O'Sullivan who shares a last name as someone in the article. When starting a new section, I've mentioned them the first time to denote which one I am referring Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "missed the final black" - we usually add "ball" after the colour. Also, can be cuegloss linked.
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "first woman ever to reach the Crucible" - I know this phrasing has been added for variety, but suggest being a bit more literal (e.g. reach the main event) as women's events have been played there too, e.g. 1998 Women's World Championship (snooker).
  • I agree Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "Steve Davis announced his retirement" - I think it be worth mentioning that this was announced after he lost to O'Brien.
  • As per above this was removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Could wikilink "century break"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Could, optionally, cuegloss-link "deciding frame"
  • agreed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "succumb to the Crucible curse," - not a phrasing I like. He lost, did not "succumb" to an abstract concept. But we've probably had this wording accepted in other FAs.
  • The curse is pretty abstract anyway. It's not an actual curse. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "received a formal warning" - from who?
  • Added Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "fellow Scot" - is this relevant?
  • Not really. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "In response, tournament organisers changed the cloth and cushions used on the tables" - doesn't look from the source like it was directly "in response" as other players had also complained.
  • reworded Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "Kyren won the next two" - "Wilson won the next two"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "he first time in 14 years that Hawkins had beaten" - could use "he" instead of "Hawkins"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Looks like per MOS:CURRENCY/MOS:DIGITS that 1409 and 1135 should be 1,409 and 1,135 for consistency with four-digit currency amounts in the article.
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "Marco Fu led Hawkins by 9–1 before Hawkins won five straight frames to within one frame at 10–9" needs tweaking
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "In the first, Ding was leading McManus 5–0 and 9–3 scoring five centuries in nine frames" - I think needs a comma after "9–3"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "McManus scored centuries of his own winning six frames to trail 8–9" - how many? Needs a comma after "own"
  • Removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "six centuries set by Davis in 1946," - should have a footnote or mention that the 1946 final was over 145 frames, not 35.
  • Added Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "The match ended just minutes after Selby's home city of Leicester celebrated Leicester City F.C.'s first ever Premier League title win" - seems a bit off-topic, if you don't mention Selby displaying their flag etc.
  • I'm not sure it's off-topic, seems like a pretty notable thing. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• "The event as a whole saw a total of 210 million viewers in China on CCTV-5.[78] of a total viewership of 300 million.[77]" - stray full stop. Maybe "The event as a whole attracted 300 million viewers in China, including 210 million on CCTV-5."?
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Can the YouTube source be replaced for "Defending champion Bingham was seeded first, while other seeded places were allocated based on the latest world rankings"? A 15 minute video isn't an ideal source.
  • I'm sure it could, but it is the official draw. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Some World Snooker sources mention WPBSA; these are linked but distinct entities.
  • Fixed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Main draw

• I don't like versions of the final table that duplicate the scores under each player. I think the version at 1985 World Snooker Championship looks better, and, with the annotations, is more accessible. This probably can't be a fatal objection though.
  • It's not an excuse, but my time is a little limited at the moment, whilst I agree with you, it can take quite some time to change these. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:47, 30 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Qualifying

• The EBSA Order of Merit - spell out what the EBSA is at first mention. The links are probably adequate for WLBSA/IBSF and EBSA in the list of qualifying players.
• Players invited by the Order of Merit were limited to one player per country" - how about "Order of Merit invitations were limited to one player per country."?

Hi Lee Vilenski. Comments above. I might have some more later. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:52, 22 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Lee Vilenski ? Gog the Mild (talk) 14:09, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I forgot the ping I have made the above two changes too BennyOnTheLoose. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:00, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Despite two minor concerns. I still think "The match ended just minutes after Selby's home city of Leicester celebrated Leicester City F.C.'s first ever Premier League title win" could do with something added to show it's relevance here, and the final table should be improved. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 12:32, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Spotchecks not done

• Why is BBC Sport italicized and Yahoo! Sports not?
• Be consistent in whether you include publication locations
• What makes SnookerHQ a high-quality reliable source? Chris Turner? Bleacher Report? Snooker.org?

Personally, I've always found SnookerHQ to be a very well written item that should be considered reliable, but there was just one entry, so I've removed it..

Chris Turner was the statistician and historian who worked for Eurosport and the BBC. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:00, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Bleacher Report has been removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:00, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Snooker.org is an award winning statistics site. Only uses direct information from match scores and dates in the article. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:00, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

What award(s)? Nikkimaria (talk) 00:18, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

According to the about us page, they were on Snooker Scene (and won website of the year in 2011), BilliardsDigest (under a different name), (and a citation in the Independent). It also suggests they won a Britannia Internet Use Guide, and were linked by the BBC Education Web Guide... But I know nothing about these sites. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 13:33, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• FNs 12 and 13 are to the same source but are formatted differently - check throughout

• Still seeing issues here, eg FNs 18 and 19 and 82 are all the same site but differently formatted. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:18, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• • • Maybe I'm looking at the wrong version, but I don't see 18 and 19 as the same. I have made a change with 81 and 82. I did change 2 and 19 too. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 13:42, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      • Now 18 and 20 (World Snooker/worldsnooker.com). Nikkimaria (talk) 01:48, 13 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
        • Oh, I see what you mean. Changed throughout. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:05, 13 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Fn14 is incomplete. Ditto FN15, FN27, check throughout

• Still issues here, eg FN79 has an author at the source that is missing from the citation. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:18, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• • • Ok, I've been through the lot and checked the authors. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:05, 13 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ok, I've caught this one. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 13:42, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • Please check all - I just clicked one (FN73) and found another missing author. Nikkimaria (talk) 01:48, 13 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• FN29 claims to be in Norwegian but is not. Ditto FN85.

Some cleanup needed here. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:46, 26 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi guys, not ignoring these - just running a bit low on time the last couple days. Get to them soon. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 13:24, 29 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I have made the source changes. There's a couple comments on the sources brought up. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:46, 29 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry NikkiMaria - I had made these changes a while ago, but never pinged through.Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:00, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging Nikkimaria as the attempt above looks to have failed. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 12:25, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Lee Vilenski, BennyOnTheLoose, and Nikkimaria: - What exactly is the status on this source review? I'm having trouble telling. Hog Farm _Talk 19:22, 23 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Still seeing issues with missing data - eg FN45 has an agency at the source but not in the citation. I'm also a bit confused by the formatting logic still - why for example does FN9 have both work and publisher when similar sources have one (but not always the same one)? Nikkimaria (talk) 02:34, 24 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Apologiesfor the late reply here - my time is limited at the moment. I'm happy to work through the formatting issues. I'll have another look through when I have a little more time. Thanks for bearing with me. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 09:00, 27 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, I have made the above changes :). Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:37, 29 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Nikkimaria, has this resolved the issues? Thanks. Gog the Mild (talk) 10:21, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Lee Vilenski, are you able to articulate in what circumstances you use work vs publisher vs both for web sources? I'm still not sure of the logic. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:29, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, I see. I've removed publisher parameters and replaced with work/website parameters where appropriate. Publishers would be for something that was originally published and then stored online, such as a newspaper or book. Hopefully this resolves your issue. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 06:34, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Cool, thanks. Nikkimaria (talk) 02:32, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Prose review. I've read many snooker articles at FAC, and watched a match or two.

• "Bingham lost 9–10 against Ali Carter in the first round falling to the Crucible curse and becoming the 17th first-time champion unable to defend his title at the venue." Suggest a comma after "round"
• "to become the first Asian player ever to reach a World Championship final." Delete ever as redundant.
• "The 32 players for the event are selected through a mix of the world snooker rankings, and pre-tournament qualification rounds." Suggest removing the comma after and; since this is a list of two items, a serial comma is usually not used.
• "Professional payers below 17th place in rankings," Is this supposed to be players?
• "The afternoon session of the final was watched by audiences of 45 million in China, the country's largest audience for a sporting event that year." I'm not thrilled with "audiences" used twice in this sentence. Maybe, "The afternoon session of the final was watched 45 million people in China, the country's largest audience for a sporting event that year."
• "including 210 million on CCTV-5." Wikilink to CCTV-5?

Those are my comments. Please ping when the above are addressed. Z1720 (talk) 15:51, 5 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've made all of the above changes Z1720, thanks for your comments. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 10:40, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Support. My concerns were addressed above. Z1720 (talk) 14:15, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• (Copied from talk page.) Any chance I could put another one in the furnace? It seems like the only outstanding issues is the formatting of sources. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 09:11, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sure. Gog the Mild (talk) 10:23, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FAC/ar, and leave the {{featured article candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Ian Rose (talk) 12:04, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.