Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sivarama Swami

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Ajpolino (talk) 00:07, 10 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sivarama Swami

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All ISKCON preachers are not notable. There is no major work or post. Fails WP:NACADEMIC and WP:ANYBIO. Sources are dependent and connected with ISKCON. (similar to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hanumatpresaka Swami) Venkat TL (talk) 15:22, 18 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions. Venkat TL (talk) 15:22, 18 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. Venkat TL (talk) 15:22, 18 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Hungary-related deletion discussions. Venkat TL (talk) 15:22, 18 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nomination. No reliable sources.--Ts12rAc^{talk to me} 20:40, 18 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Unlike Hanumatpresaka, Shivarama Swami is written about and/or cited in plenty of academic texts: see [1], [2], [3], [4], [5]. It would be nice if the nominator could do a cursory search of Google Books/Scholar before starting these kinds of AfDs. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 14:51, 19 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Look I have no intentions to reply with a volley of personal attacks, though I am very capable of. So lets stick to the topic of the discussion. The author of [1] is associated with ISKCON. Rest are passing mentions. The subject should have achievement to merit an article.Being part of a cult and holding some cult office and getting passing mentions for it does not cut it, to get a Wikipedia bio, such people should stick to self promotion on ISKCON websites. Venkat TL (talk) 15:21, 19 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A few more here: [6], [7], [8]. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 15:52, 19 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Draftify There may be enough here of notability outside the cult. But it is written in an overpersonal promotional style, and needs extensive editing. DGG ( talk ) 02:27, 21 January 2022 (UTC) .[reply]

I agree the article is a mess. I'm happy to spend some time on it. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 07:11, 21 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, – AssumeGoodWraith (talk | contribs) 04:13, 26 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: @Dāsānudāsa: thanks for working on this, it's a huge transformation from the article that was originally nominated for AfD. There are still some basic facts in this biography that are not cited to WP:RS though - one of the footnotes cites hu-wiki. Is it possible to clear these up? I did not do a terribly in-depth check but I'm surprised that I've come up empty on this and a quick check on the publisher that is responsible for most of his books (I was looking to see if we could get a WP:AUTHOR pass). I'm surprised to find so little for a national order of merit winner, but I'm truly out of my depth with Magyar so I can't really help here. -- asilvering (talk) 05:03, 26 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, @Asilvering: it was really only a quick pass to get rid of some of the puffery. When I get time, I'll go over it more thoroughly to add in some of the RS I've listed above. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 09:01, 26 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Took me a while to get access to JSTOR paper you linked. Very disappointed to see that Link [6] has only 2 passing mentions, first line saying that (1) he is ISKCON guru and (2) he teaches Cow protection (citing ISKCON literature and SivaramaSwami website). Link [7] has 2 passing mentions that he found a valley and named it a pilgrim place (citing ISKCON literature.). Link [8] again has 2 passing mentions, citing ISKCON literature. If you are going to share any more link then also share why you feel it is worth looking into. Let's respect each others time. User:Asilvering an Order of 7, awarded on Philanthropy will not make the subject pass WP:ANYBIO.Venkat TL (talk) 11:53, 26 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"Why [I] feel it is worth looking into" is because I think there's a difference between people like Hanumatpresaka Swami and the principal of Radhadesh (I can't remember the name), who are known only to ISKCON members, and those like Sivarama (and Radhanath, etc.), who are huge on social media, mentioned in the literature as being leaders in a notable religious movement, and have generally crossed over into mainstream notability. I respect your time, of course, and have supported your AfDs of those people and things who are clearly not notable. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 19:38, 26 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 16:32, 2 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.