Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Janet Reno High School

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Hmm...interesting. I've never seen an article about a high school that doesn't exist yet. Sr 13 03:43, 21 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Janet Reno High School

The school doesn't yet exist (WP:CRYSTAL) and no claim for notability is made (WP:NOTE). --Cerejota 01:03, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Delete This article has no reason for existance. It is only notable to people in N. Miami.SpecialAgentUncleTito 01:29, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per CRYSTAL policy. It's hard enough to sell notability of schools that exist... Shalom ^Hello 01:54, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Weak Keep, perhaps the fact it will be located on a former superfund site is notable. Pats Sox Princess 02:21, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
DeleteThis subject appears non-notable. --Stormbay 02:50, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Why didn't the nominator notify the article's creator on that editor's talk page that there's an AfD? It's a basic, decent, civil thing to do. Noroton 03:06, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

From WP:AFD, "How to list articles for deletion" section: "While not required, it is generally considered courteous to notify the good-faith creator and any main contributors of the articles that you are nominating for deletion." Noroton 03:22, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As your quoted text indicates, the nominator has not violated any requirements, and your being upset is not germane to this discussion. --Dhartung | Talk 03:53, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

How would Dhartung know I was upset? And if Dhartung's concern is comments being germane, that editor's comments would have gone on my talk page. Noroton 04:57, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Reply I appreciate your comment Dhartung. Noroton, please assume good faith this was not intentionally done. I am doing it now.--Cerejota 03:57, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Cerejota, it wasn't your good faith I was questioning, certainly not as WP:AGF defines it. Thank you for notifying the editor. Noroton 04:57, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Then why you called me indecent and uncivil?--Cerejota 07:52, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't. Although I'm trying to look at my comments from your point of view and I can see why you might think that. I don't think you're indecent or uncivil, and your promptly notifying the creator of the article was proof of that. I'm sorry my comments came out so harshly.Noroton 16:09, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Alll coool then......--Cerejota 00:51, 17 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per WP:CRYSTAL. --Dhartung | Talk 03:53, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
keep I created the article after I saw that there was an article for North Miami Senior High School and other schools in the district, Janet Reno High School is part of the same school district, so it seemed like it was a reasonable addition to Wikipedia. Also notable that it is being built on a superfund site that has not yet been cleaned. While I also don't want to see wikipedia filled with useless trivia, I think any public school history/info is well suited to this centralized user-driven encyclopedia, it is the kind of subject that will over time may have a lot of contributions from people with interesting knowledge and interest in their schools. --RandomStuff 05:52, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
~~Weak Keep~~ (see "Changed Vote" below) per WP:CRYSTAL: event is "notable and almost certain to take place" since building the schools was a goal of the municipal government and approval has been given by the city council, the mayor, the school district and the federal EPA says the land is OK for use. "Oct. 1--City approves new schools plan / After arguments that threatened to derail the plan, the North Miami City Council unanimously approved last week to trade city land for new schools. [...] All the schools will be built by the county school board. Previously, the plan was for developers of Biscayne Landing to build the high schools under city supervision, then turn them over to the school board. The new North Miami Senior High School would have 3,660 students, while the smaller Janet Reno High School would have 1,560." [[1]

Apparently the land is owned by the city, with the developer leasing it, and building the school is a requirement the city placed on the developer. Actually, the city government has decided to take over building it, so I assume the developer is only paying for it. Even as a proposal, the thing seems to be noteworthy. Oh, and the school district is on board as well:

"Turnkey construction by the City of North Miami of a second new 1,560-seat high school on City-owned land under a long-term lease agreement with the City with a projected opening in 2008. [...] The school will be near Biscayne Landing, a new development [...]"[2]

Here's a caveat though: So far, only 91 units for the Biscayne Landing development have been sold. This article [3] mentions that sales may be going a bit slowly. I don't know how that affects the prospects for the school. This article indicates the city government will bend over backwards for them: [4] This one indicates the county won't: [5] Perhaps if the developer folds the money won't be there to build Janet Reno High, but I'm speculating. Prospects seem very good, but it seems to me it's a judgment call as to whether it's "almost certain". Noroton 06:11, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - WP:CRYSTAL doesn't support the inclusion of this school at this stage as a separate article: it is not "notable and almost certain to take place", because not even the ground work has been laid. When and if the building starts, then we might include it if notable. WP:CRYSTAL's spirit and intention is that inaccurate content doesn't fall through the cracks, what if the school name changes? what if the location changes? what if it doesn't get built?. If there is notability around the Biscayne Landing (a focus of COI edits, which is how I go wind of this school article), then it belongs in Biscayne Landing, not on its own. WP:CRYSTAL is crystal clear.--Cerejota 06:24, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Construction itself isn't the standard -- "notable and almost certain to take place" is.Noroton 16:09, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Changed vote: Merge to Biscayne Landing (Delete) We don't have enough information on how this is supposed to be paid for if the sales at Biscayne Landing don't go through. Until we do, or until we have some other reason that it is "almost certain to take place" we should hold off on an article. It's possible that the high school project could snag on some planning board approval. I think there's certaily enough information the article linked to and that I linked to above to make the Biscayne Landing project notable whether it succeeds or sinks into the muck, and this would be a worthy and necessary section of it. Noroton 16:09, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Strong keep Article is new I think it deserves more than 5 days to be expanded. Plus, for the students and teachers it is summer vacation so many of those that are most knowledgable about the subject may not be around to update it. I say give it several months, well into the fall, and then reconsider the issue. Postcard Cathy 07:24, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment You might not realize this, because of your comment, but subject of this page doesn't even exists. In other words, we cannot wait for fall so that students provide content, because there are no students, as the school hasn't even started being built. Please consider this information, because it seems you don't have it.--Cerejota 07:44, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

My opinion cerejota is still the same and for the same reasons. So, it won't be students and teachers but the various school district officials. See the forest through the trees or whatever that saying is. The point was the most knowledgeable people are on vacation or probably are. Those that aren't on vacation are busy preparing for school to open. Give the people time to find the article and expand it when they can. Postcard Cathy 08:07, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Cerejota brings up a good point about conflict of interest. If Wikipedia is used to lend credence to real estate agents trying to sell homes in Biscayne Landing, then the readers aren't helped and Wikipedia is definitely hurt. If the article is deleted or redirected to the Biscayne Landing article, it can certainly be revived later.Noroton 16:09, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Irrelevant comment - Dude, they're building this school on a landfill site ? Janet Reno would be proud. Guroadrunner 08:35, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep All high schools are notable. Mowsbury 12:56, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, come back if it exists. >Radiant< 14:14, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
N Delete without prejudice. A not-yet built facility could be notable if the plans and construction receive significant coverage. But the article as it stands has no reliable, independent sources verifying notability. VanTucky ^(talk) 17:05, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:CRYSTAL - Nothing to establish notability now Corpx 17:58, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete it fails WP:CRYSTAL. Not sure it would be notable even if it were built. New England ^{(C) (H)} 19:58, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:CRYSTAL, although I have no doubt it will be nn when it actually opens its doors. Eusebeus 21:18, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete--and it will be difficult for a new school to demonstrate notability, since the factors usually used are alumni and awards (athletic or academic). DGG (talk) 23:47, 16 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- I think it will be incredibly easy for anyone who follows the news in that area to find several newspaper articles about the official plans for the school, approval of the school by the board of education, construction of the school and opening of the school. All will be covered by independent, reliable news organizations. Noroton 05:47, 20 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete and footnote into Janet Reno. 70.55.88.166 04:58, 17 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete self-evident. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Victor falk (talk • contribs)
Delete - schoolcruft, all of them. --Storm Rider ^(talk) 00:38, 18 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete yet another entirely non-notable school. --Icarus ^(Hi!) 04:58, 18 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Merge and redirect to North Miami, Florida until the school actually exists. For now a redirect is sufficient. Burntsauce 18:19, 20 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, the school doesn't even exist yet. --Android Mouse 18:45, 20 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.