Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Croatian Operational Research Society

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. (WP:NPASR). NORTH AMERICA¹⁰⁰⁰ 16:50, 25 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Croatian Operational Research Society (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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Minor society with (according to themselves) only 150 members. No independent sources, no indication of any notability. Does not meet WP:ORG. Randykitty (talk) 15:02, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

For the same reasons, I am co-nominating the following articles:

Finnish Operations Research Society

Hungarian Operations Research Society

Italian Operations Research Society

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions.  ^B E _C K ^Y _S A ^{Y L} E _S  15:12, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science-related deletion discussions.  ^B E _C K ^Y _S A ^{Y L} E _S  15:12, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Croatia-related deletion discussions.  ^B E _C K ^Y _S A ^{Y L} E _S  15:12, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• National Operational Research societies, even small ones (by membership) are important as they form the core of the International Federation of Operational Research Societies (IFORS) and of the Association of European Operational Research Societies (EURO). As such, each of these deserves its own wikipedia article (I don't have time to publish all of them at once, but my objective in the long run is to cover all European societies). Bfortz (talk) 15:21, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment I think you're wasting your time, mostof these societies do not and will never meet WP:ORG. If there is anything encyclopedic to tell about such a national society, you could conceivably include it in the article on the European or international association (if independent reliable sources can be found). But stand alone articles don't seem to be justified. --Randykitty (talk) 16:06, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• As noted above, National Operational Research Societies are important both nationally and as part of the wider Operational Research community. Some were formed many years ago and all the ones we are uploading have had a rigorous check of their statutes and processes by both International Federation of Operational Research Societies (IFORS) and Association of European Operational Research Societies (EURO). National societies operate as a service to both academics and practitioners within their own country, but also support collaborative practice internationally, so their recognition is important and their contribution to International Federation of Operational Research Societies (IFORS) and Association of European Operational Research Societies (EURO) is valuable even where they appear small in terms of membership. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sarahfores (talk • contribs) 15:52, 25 January 2015 (UTC) — Sarahfores (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
• Comment Notability is the issue here, not "importance", and we should only have articles on subjects that have been covered in depth by reliable secondary sources independent of the subject. Should this and other nation's Operational Research Societies fail to meet WP:GNG or WP:ORG, merging to the European region's article would be appropriate, especially if the scope and purpose of each Society is largely the same. --Animalparty-- (talk) 16:13, 25 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment As the president of the Croatian Operational Research Society, I can confirm that the influence of this society to the scientific community can be proved by external links to secondary resources - conferences that we organize, journals that we publish, society that link to us. Please do not delete this page in another few days until we add those links that will support our notability. Marijana — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mzekicsusac (talk • contribs)

• Comment Mzekicsusac has just added a bunch of external links to the article. Despite their promotional nature or irrelevance, I have left them there for other editors to check. As far as I can see, none of them are independent sources confirming any notability for this society. --Randykitty (talk) 17:51, 27 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• This sounds like a case of WP:BRANCH. --Joy [shallot] (talk) 21:01, 27 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment The page of the Italian Operations Research Society now includes links to: (i) two articles appeared on Corriere della Sera and one article appeared on Repubblica (the two major Italian newspapers) referring to the society and to society members; (ii) the entry of another international Encyclopedia (the Wiley Encyclopedia of Operations Research and Management Science) on the history of the society; (iii) the page of http://www.mathematics-in-europe.eu which lists the society among the 9 Italian mathematical societies. I believe these independent sources are an indication of notability of a society that has existed for over half a century. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.193.148.167 (talk) 21:39, 27 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - as already mentioned by Joy, the Croatian article looks is WP:BRANCH at best, and lacks WP:RS whatsoever. I have not checked the co-nominations (hence the "comment" !vote). Tigraan (talk) 13:52, 18 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep all. Each of these is recognized by the International Federation of Operational Research Societies (the umbrella international organization for this discipline) as the major national society for their country — see the IFORS list of national societies (and in the case of Italy, see the Wikipedia article for the mismatch between what IFORS calls the society and what we call it — it's the same society under a different name). I don't want to suggest that any academic society that calls itself a national-level society is notable, but I think the ones in major disciplines (e.g. the topic of entire university departments) that are internationally recognized by their peer societies as the main society for their country are notable. As for the invocations of WP:BRANCH above: I think it would be a mistake to merge these into the "parent" organization. They are not branches of IFORS (the way AEORS seems to be). They are independent societies that happen to hold memberships in IFORS, in the same way that people and corporations might happen to hold memberships in these societies. In particular, I think that recognition by IFORS should count towards notability as being independent of the subject, because these societies are separate entities rather than being part of IFORS. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:16, 24 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • PS As well as the recognition by IFORS, all of these articles now have at least one independently, reliably published, and in-depth source on their history. —David Eppstein (talk) 06:34, 25 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.