Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bekim Bejta

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. no real consensus for deletion/seems more of a consensus to keep based on sources/notability JForget 00:22, 2 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Bekim Bejta

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Self promotional article written in superlative, not notable and the main contributor to the article seems to be the user with the same name as the article. kedadial 16:35, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 17:26, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep According to KosovaAlbaner, he received the Kosovo National Literary Prize for the translation of the work by Jean-Marie Gustave Le Clézio. See also [1], [2], [3], [4]. Btw, is the karate world champion and recordman of the same name the same person? I doubt it. Vejvančický (talk) 06:33, 11 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

...It is of course possible that Shakespeare translator broke eight push-ups world records, but this is... well, very unusual. --Vejvančický (talk) 08:23, 11 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 19:52, 17 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comment and Questions. I do not think he meets WP:PROF with one linguistic publication. No hits in google scholar. Youtube is not a reliable source, so there's no source for his being a world karate champion in the article itself. Is being a Guiness Book record holder sufficient to establish notability? The award looks good though, for that I'm on the fence. Also, while foreign languages sources can be reliable, I believe they are supposed to be accompanied by translations--Vejvančický, can you provide translations of relevant material from the sources you mention above, and incoporate them in some form in the article? I'm willing to lend a hand editing the language if there are some better sources to work with. --Nuujinn (talk) 23:45, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:04, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Second relist rationale. The article is a BLP. --Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:06, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep as an author on the basis of the translations as well as the academic books. DGG ( talk ) 01:10, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Does not appear to satisfy WP:BIO. Edison (talk) 01:17, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
~~Weak Delete~~ Neutral Really on the line. Although extensive and with sources, I see notability established - but unsure if it is enough for WP inclusion. Outback the koala (talk) 08:01, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: no opinion yet on his work as a translator, but his work as a linguist seems thoroughly non-notable. His presumed "main work" was published with L'Harmattan, Paris, which is essentially a self-publishing outlet with no quality control, and its impact in scholarship appears to be zero – no references to it anywhere in the academic literature. Fut.Perf. ☼ 08:44, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Comment What is concerning to me is the karate/push-ups intermezzo. I'm convinced that the article describes two different persons. The sources mentioned above ([5], [6], [7], [8], [9]) clearly say that Bejta has won in the "best translation" section of the Kosovo National Literary Prize. I can't speak or read Albanian, I'm using Google translator. Perhaps the nominator, who seems to be a native speaker, could say more. --Vejvančický (talk) 10:20, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- That the literary/linguistic Bejta and the pushups Bejta should be two different persons seems unlikely – both aspects have been in the article from the very first edit, which was made by the apparent autobio account Bekim Bejta (talk · contribs). Fut.Perf. ☼ 10:32, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've noted that, Fut.Perf.. However, I don't believe that. None of the independent sources treating literary/linguistic Bejta mention his second profession, and none of the sources treating Bejta karatist mention his literary skills, only Wikipedia and its mirrors. Bekim Bejta (talk · contribs) (karatist or linguist or completely unrelated person) made confusion here, in my opinion. We need people fluent in Albanian language to resolve this problem. --Vejvančický (talk) 11:05, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I take your point. I've also looked a bit at photographs to clear this up: Here and here are videos of Karate-Bejta. He's the short-haired blond guy apparently. Here is a press photograph of the prize ceremony where Literature-Bejta was honoured. Though both the karate videos and the photo are quite low resolution and low quality, it does seem fair to say that none of the guys on the literature prize photo look like the guy on the karate video. If these are indeed different people, the account who created the article was not just a run-of-the-mill autobio n00b, but a deliberate vandal. Fut.Perf. ☼ 11:24, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed... if our assumption is correct. Thanks for your investigation and for the work on the article. Vejvančický (talk) 11:48, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

By the way, I've not been able to verify his status as a Karate champion here, at the website of the Karate organisation that ran the championship. Note that this "WKA" seems to be a rather small and not particularly prestigious organisation, not to be confused with the World Karate Federation that runs the better-known Karate World Championships. Fut.Perf. ☼ 12:06, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

'~~Delete'~~, Looks like the pushup claim is bogus as well, see [[10]] and [[11]]. All righty then, if the Linguistics publication is non-notable, and the karate artiste and translator are two different people, and there's no pushups guiness record. my opinion is that however many people we're talking about, none of them are notable. Many thanks to Future Perfect. --Nuujinn (talk) 12:19, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

There is still the national literary award for translation, Nuujinn. This is an official recognition, is it sufficient for inclusion here? --Vejvančický (talk) 12:40, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, since you brought that up I thought about it a great deal. By WP:PROF, the relevant criterion would be "a highly prestigious academic award or honor at a national or international level". The sources are in albanian, and google's not good at translating that, so it's difficult to assess the significance of the award. The other issue is whether Kosovo should be considered a nation. My feeling is that this does not quite reach the level of notability, but if there's someone who can provide a good translation or if there are any other sources, I'll be happy to reconsider. --Nuujinn (talk) 15:37, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, we need help of a native speaker. In my limited purview, I compare with a similar literary prize awarded in my country - Magnesia Litera. The competition has very similar structure and level and is considered as a high recognition within the Czech Republic. The experts select the best literary works in a national language. It is not the Man Booker Prize, of course. --Vejvančický (talk) 16:16, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps not, but if one considers Kosovo a nation (I'm on the fence, it's arguably a de facto nation if not de jure), and we can substantiate the award a bit better, it would count under WP:PROF. I'll poke around and see what I can find. --Nuujinn (talk) 18:05, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry I'm late for the discussion. I reviewed the given links and they cover more or less the same event. Here is my translation: "Bekim Bejta, was awarded with the prize of literary for translating Raga. Approche du continent invisible by Jean-Marie Gustave le Clezio". The award was given by the Ministry of Culture of the Republic of Kosovo, on 4 March 2010. Cheers. kedadial 20:32, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

@Nuujinn Kosovo is definitely a de facto state, that is a fact. If it is de jure, depends entirely on your point of view. Outback the koala (talk) 08:08, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know whether Kosovo is de facto or de jure nation, however, the local literary community awarded a person, who made a good translation and enriched the local cultural scene. I'm not sure with the status of the Ministry of Culture of the Republic of Kosovo, I'm not familiar with the complicated and sensitive situation in that area. Unfortunately, the online sources are very weak and nobody here seems to have access to the specialised literary journals in Kosovo. --Vejvančický (talk) 08:33, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Weak Keep Kedadi, thanks for the assist. I've withdrawn my delete vote, given that the source looks clean, and that Kosovo is likely going to stick around for the foreseeable future. --Nuujinn (talk) 17:48, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per the discussion above - sourcing seems adequate to establish notability. Regards, Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 21:39, 1 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.