User talk:In23065/Archive/2008

This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Hi In23065, I just wanted to let you know that I am reverting your edit to the Template: Big Brother UK sidebar. The current format for all Big Brother sidebars call for this order: Presenters (must be shown), Shows (must be collapsed), Current Series/Season (if one, cannot be collapsed), Past Series/Seasons (must be collapsed). If you have a new order that would befit the sidebars then please start a discussion at WP:BIGBRO as these changes need to be discussed first with the project and must be applied to all. Thanks and if you have any questions please feel free to drop a line at my talk page. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 21:54, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Big Brother 2008 (UK) has been proposed for deletion. An editor felt this information might be inappropriate for Wikipedia because it is about something which has not happened yet. Please review Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not for the relevant policy. If you can improve the article to address these concerns, please do so, citing sources.

If no one objects to the deletion within five days by removing the "prod" notice, the article may be deleted without further discussion. If you remove the prod notice, the deletion process will stop, but if an editor is still not satisfied that the article meets Wikipedia guidelines, it may be sent to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion for consensus. --Hiltonhampton (talk) 00:18, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Please don't create new pages from old by copying and pasting unless you write into the edit summary where the text came from. Failing to do this is a copyright violation, as you take the credit for all the text even though you didn't write it. --kingboyk (talk) 22:31, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

i didnt i copied it from a different page on wikipedia In23065 (talk) 15:54, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Hello. Please don't forget to provide an edit summary. Thank you. (DANG that was scary to see!) - CobaltBlueTony™ _talk 19:04, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

This is an automated message from CorenSearchBot. I have performed a web search with the contents of Secret Story (2007), and it appears to be very similar to another wikipedia page: Secret Story (TV series). It is possible that you have accidentally duplicated contents, or made an error while creating the page— you might want to look at the pages and see if that is the case.

This message was placed automatically, and it is possible that the bot is confused and found similarity where none actually exists. If that is the case, you can remove the tag from the article and it would be appreciated if you could drop a note on the maintainer's talk page. CorenSearchBot (talk) 23:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you recently copied the contents of a page and pasted it into another with a different name. This is what we call a "cut and paste move", and it is very undesirable because it splits the article's history, which is needed for attribution and is helpful in many other ways. The mechanism we use for renaming articles is to move it to a new name which both preserves the page's history and automatically creates a redirect from the old title to the new. In most cases, you should be able to move an article yourself using the "Move" tab at the top of the page. If there is an article that you cannot move yourself by this process, follow the instructions at Wikipedia:Requested moves to request the move by another. Also, if there are any other articles that you copied and pasted, even if it was a long time ago, please list them at Wikipedia:Cut and paste move repair holding pen. Thank you. -- lucasbfr ^talk 18:08, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Um In23065 why did you remove the Controversy section from the article and placed bits pertaining to each version on their pages without a proper discussion? Also I thought you were going to make a version of the "series" table in your sandbox. I think the links should go back into the table as each country has an official website for the show and most countries have sites for their spin-off editions. Also I think that E4 under under the Network portion under the US section shouldn't be there. An individual mention in Big Brother 4 (U.S.) and Big Brother 9 (U.S.) is sufficient enough. CBS & Global should be the networks listed since they have aired each season to date plus the US & Canada viewers are the only ones able to participate in votes, etc. This is just helpful information and my thoughts on how to improve the article. I think the modifications you made to the table makes it look cleaner. And I have had a discussion on WP:BIGBRO that I would like your opinion on. I suggested it back in January but no one has commented yet. I mentioned in the discussion about how the lead should be re-written and how the "Variations in Format" section was really a bunch of twists. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 09:09, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Hello. Please don't forget to provide an edit summary, which wasn't included with your recent edit to Template:Big Brother UK. Thank you. Your edits on Template:Big Brother UK removed content pertaining to the subject. Please remember that deleting content from articles or templates may seem to look like vandalism. If you think something should be changed or deleted please have a discussion about it first. Thanks. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 06:29, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading or contributing to Image:BBAuEye2008.jpg. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is not a suitable explanation or rationale as to why each specific use in Wikipedia constitutes fair use. Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free media lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. NOTE: once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. STBotI (talk) 13:56, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for uploading Image:Balls of Steel.png. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously. It may be deleted soon, unless we can determine the license and the source of the image. If you know this information, then you can add a copyright tag to the image description page.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks again for your cooperation. NOTE: once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. STBotI (talk) 23:48, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, please remember that the seventh season of Big Brother (U.S.) is also a special edition. Special editions such as All-Stars, Celebrity, etc. are separated in their own sections in the "Big Brother series" table. In the case with Big Brother (U.S.) the main editions are 1,2,3,4,5,6,8,9,10. Season 7 is in the All-Stars category. Please do not revert this again without a discussion as it will be counted as vandalism. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 22:00, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Sorry i just thought that someone had vandalised it and gotten rid of it not that it was in a different sectionIn23065 (talk) 14:24, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Big Brother Newsletter - April 2008

WikiProject Big Brother Newsletter Volume I, No. 1 - April 2008 About The WikiProject Big Brother newsletter is a monthly newsletter regarding the project. Started by Alucard 16, if you are interested in helping with the newsletter, please see the WikiProject's talkpage. Big Brother On Air There are currently six editions of Big Brother on air.: Big Brother (Albania) (First edition) Big Brother 8 (Germany) Big Brother 8 (Brazil) Grande Fratello 8 (Italy) Big Brother 9 (United States) Pinoy Big Brother: Teen Edition Plus Future Big Brother editions There are three confirmed editions of Big Brother to air during the summer of 2008: Big Brother 2008 (Australia) Big Brother 2008 (United Kingdom) Big Brother 10 (United States) Project objectives Country-specific articles - See the next column. Nomination/Voting History Tables - Many articles do not follow the guidelines of Nominations table and Voting history table section. All nomination/voting history tables should follow the basic guideline on the main project page (Colors, terms, etc.) but should be adjusted for each country/region. Country-specific Please help us improve the country-specific articles by providing references, reception details, and production details. Please don't add trivia, quotes, or original research to these articles. Aside from Big Brother (U.S.), Big Brother (UK), Big Brother Australia, and Pinoy Big Brother most Big Brother articles do not follow the standard outline set out by the project. Most articles list statistic information from worldofbigbrother.com and trivia. Assessment Scale You will see Assessment scale information on each of the Big Brother article talk pages. The article will be rated according to the Assessment scale. Please consider looking at the status of the article to improve it. If the article has changed and the rating is outdated, you can change it or bring it up on the WikiProject talkpage. We are trying to improve these articles, hopefully bring some to good or featured status. We would like your help reaching this goal. We hope to bring main articles, Big Brother (TV series), Big Brother (UK), Big Brother (US), etc. to featured status. Please help us improve these article, based on the peer reviews and your knowledge of Wikipedia featured articles. WP:Task Force Heard of Wikipedia: Task Force? A task force is a non-independent subgroup of a larger WikiProject that covers some defined part of the WikiProject's scope. Task forces for WikiProject Big Brother can be used to focus on a specific country/region's Big Brother. A task force for example that would focus on Big Brother (U.S.) related articles could rely on WikiProject Big Brother for article structure information while providing more focus and customized guidelines for Big Brother (U.S.). Similar task forces can be created for Big Brother (UK), Big Brother Australia, etc. Contributers ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪

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Hi, I have reverted your edit to Big Brother (TV series). Please don't add a network to a different country's version of Big Brother like you did with Big Brother UK. Unless there is a proper source for these extra networks like E4 airing BB9 US then please don't add them back as it speculation. Remember Verifiability, Thanks. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:22, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure if you have ever read Verifiability, it basically states what editors can and can't use as source in an article. Generally national newspapers fulfil those guidelines. Weasel words like rumoured are an anathema to Wikipedia so they have good reason to be reverted.

If editors take their time to add sources to an article I'm not sure if you should really be threatening them with a ban. I'm not even sure what you mean by a ban? Editing requirements which don't meet the policy or guidelines of Wikipedia could be seen as an ownership problem with an article or conversely as an attempt to disrupt Wikipedia. I am sure that you acted in good faith to preserve the credibility of the article but please act within the spirit of Wikipedia. BpEps - t@lk 00:06, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

HE CANT BAN PEOPLE! AND EVEN IF HE COULD ITS NOT BIGGY! HE'S JUST A LITTLE BABY WHO THOWS HIS TOYS OUT THE PRAM WHEN HE DOESN'T GET HIS PATHETIC WAY! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.203.149.17 (talk) 21:52, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Please stop edit warring. You reverted my formatting change twice, and each time gave no explanation. OK, so you made a comment between the two instances, but otherwise are acting as though Wikipedia revolves around your opinions.

Please make an effort to discuss disputed changes and allow a consensus to be reached. See also WP:EW and WP:ROWN. -- Smjg (talk) 22:46, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Big Brother Newsletter - May 2008

WikiProject Big Brother Newsletter Volume I, No. 2 - May 2008 About The WikiProject Big Brother newsletter is a monthly newsletter regarding the project. Started by Alucard 16, if you are interested in helping with the newsletter, please see the WikiProject's talkpage. Big Brother On Air There are currently four editions of Big Brother on air.: Big Brother (Albania) Big Brother 8 (Germany) Big Brother 8 (Australia) Pinoy Big Brother: Teen Edition Plus Future Big Brother editions There are three confirmed editions of Big Brother to air during the summer of 2008: Big Brother 9 (United Kingdom) (late May/early June) Big Brother 10 (United States) (July 13, 2008) Big Brother 3 (Africa) (August 24, 2008) Project objectives Vandalism - Current seasons of Big Brother are prone to have major vandalism when an edition is running. Help prevent vandalism across all Big Brother articles by reverting it and leaving the appropriate warnings on talk pages. Country-specific articles - See the next column. Nomination/Voting History Tables - Many articles do not follow the guidelines of Nominations table and Voting history table section. All nomination/voting history tables should follow the basic guideline on the main project page (Colors, terms, etc.) but should be adjusted for each country/region. Country-specific Please help us improve the country-specific articles by providing references, reception details, and production details. Please don't add trivia, quotes, or original research to these articles. Aside from Big Brother (U.S.), Big Brother (UK), Big Brother Australia, and Pinoy Big Brother most Big Brother articles do not follow the standard outline set out by the project. Most articles list statistic information from worldofbigbrother.com and trivia. Assessment Scale You will see Assessment scale information on each of the Big Brother article talk pages. The article will be rated according to the Assessment scale. Please consider looking at the status of the article to improve it. If the article has changed and the rating is outdated, you can change it or bring it up on the WikiProject talkpage. We are trying to improve these articles, hopefully bring some to good or featured status. We would like your help reaching this goal. We hope to bring main articles, Big Brother (TV series), Big Brother (UK), Big Brother (US), etc. to featured status. Please help us improve these article, based on the peer reviews and your knowledge of Wikipedia featured articles. WP:Task Force Heard of Wikipedia: Task Force? A task force is a non-independent subgroup of a larger WikiProject that covers some defined part of the WikiProject's scope. Task forces for WikiProject Big Brother can be used to focus on a specific country/region's Big Brother. A task force for example that would focus on Big Brother (U.S.) related articles could rely on WikiProject Big Brother for article structure information while providing more focus and customized guidelines for Big Brother (U.S.). Similar task forces can be created for Big Brother (UK), Big Brother Australia, etc. Newsletter notice After this newsletter, all newsletters will be bi-monthly instead of monthly. This will help me gather more information and stuff for a better newsletter. If anyone would like to help with the project newsletter please do just visit the project's talk page. The next newsletter will be in July. Contributers ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪

The above newsletter was delivered by an automatic bot because you are registered on the WikiProject Big Brother spamlist. Please feel free to remove yourself if you do not wish to receive these messages anymore.

→ Please direct all enquiries to the WikiProject talk page.
→ This newsletter/release was delivered by ENewsBot · 10:43, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Why did you delete my 2 post. A Candela (talk) 01:24, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

They the discussion page is there to discuse what is in the article and how it can be changed and is not there to report storys.

Hi, Since Terri was evicted and if she passes her mission and is allowed to become a housemate again then her row would be like this:

	Week 1	Week 2	Week 3	Week 4	Week 5	Week 6	Week 7	Week 8	Week 9	Week 10	Week 11	Week 12
Public Nomination	No Public Vote
Terri	Nobbi	HouseGuest				Re-evicted Day xx

Similar to Sharon's row on Big Brother 9 (U.S.) where her & Jacob was evicted on Day 3 but she returned on Day 7 as Neil's replacement. Due to her coming back before the second eviction she doesn't have an "Evicted Day xx" just a "Re-evicted Day xx". However if she is just a HouseGuest and nothing more then it would look like this:

	Week 1	Week 2	Week 3	Week 4	Week 5	Week 6	Week 7	Week 8	Week 9	Week 10	Week 11	Week 12
Public Nomination	No Public Vote
Terri	Nobbi	HouseGuest		Evicted Day 1

♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 16:47, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

But if she passes her task of looking after corey then she will be come a housemate again and then we wont know when she was evicted in the first place. In23065 (talk) 16:49, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

It should be kept like this as this show the most information and the ones above lead you to believe that she was never evicted.

	Week 1		Week 2	Week 3	Week 4	Week 5	Week 6	Week 7	Week 8	Week 9	Week 10	Week 11	Week 12
Public Nomination	No Public Vote
Terri	Nobbi	Evicted (Day 1)	HouseGuest				Re-evicted Day xx

In23065 (talk) 16:57, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

I have to disagree with you it is in the evicted row for Week One that she was evicted, also a note should be put in Week 2 to clarify that she was in fact evicted and she is classed as a HouseGuest. Again it is the same case with Sharon from Big Brother 9 (U.S.), please look at that table. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 17:09, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Name on thing that is bad about my way of presenting the information. Because I can think of loads of bad points about yours. In23065 (talk) 17:26, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Your version makes the table look crowed and junked up. It really isn't good with tables like the ones used in past Australian series. Also again to keep up with the goal to standardize the articles (AU, UK, USA, etc) Sharon in Big Brother 9 (U.S.) would have to be altered to include an "Evicted Day 3" but again would really make the table looked junked up. For now it looks fine but as a season progresses it will look really looked junked up. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:08, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Hi In23065, I just wanted say with images if you upload a new version (like the BB9 UK Eye) it is best to just replace the one already up. I re-uploaded the higher quality file to replace Image:Bb9uklogo.gif since it had a Fair Use for both articles. Also the file name needs to be more specific than just Big Brother Eye as that name could refer to any of the show's eyes. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:16, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Where do you get off saying "You are not a admin yet you think you own the place get over your self and do something good for the article and not just to make your self look good" I was contributing to the article. I have been contributing to various articles now for a while not just Big Brother. No I don't own the place nor do I think I own anything on Wikipedia. Get your facts straight, you make major changes without discussion, you think your way is always right, so who here has ownership issues. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:22, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

When I make changes you then revert them and say discuss, how about you discuss before changing them In23065 (talk) 23:27, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

The logo wasn't a big issue, I just said that the name Image:Big_Brother_Eye.gif was vague and could mean any of the UK eyes and next year some editor could upload the potential BB10 eye to the same file name and overwrite the BB9 eye. However you moved the page from Big Brother 2008 to Big Brother 9 without a discussion. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:36, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

I am sorry if I had offended you in any way but if you have an issue with me please comment on my page instead of the edit summary of a page. Thanks. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:42, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Hello, this is a message from an automated bot. A tag has been placed on Image:Big Brother Eye.gif, by another Wikipedia user, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. The tag claims that it should be speedily deleted because Image:Big Brother Eye.gif is a duplicate of an already existing article, category or image.

To contest the tagging and request that administrators wait before possibly deleting Image:Big Brother Eye.gif, please affix the template {{hangon}} to the page, and put a note on its talk page. If the article has already been deleted, see the advice and instructions at WP:WMD. Feel free to contact the bot operator if you have any questions about this or any problems with this bot, bearing in mind that this bot is only informing you of the nomination for speedy deletion; it does not perform any nominations or deletions itself. To see the user who deleted the page, click here CSDWarnBot (talk) 04:03, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

A proposed deletion template has been added to the article Big Brother 2008 (UK) Daily Highlights, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice should explain why (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and Wikipedia's deletion policy). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{dated prod}} notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. Do you want to opt out of receiving this notice? ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 09:43, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Hey In23065, I just have a question what does Tom Thurlow present related to Big Brother UK. I noticed you added him to the list of current presenters of Template:Big Brother UK and Template:Big Brother UK sidebar but I don't know what show he presents, I know George & Zezi are Little Brother, guest presenters are for Big Mouth and Iain & Gemma are Big Ears but what does Tom Thurlow present. I didn't revert your edits because I didn't know what he presented but anonymous IP user has reverted your changes on Template:Big Brother UK I again didn't revert that change because I don't know what he presents. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 04:11, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

He presents the Big Brother On the Streets Programme on E4.com In23065 (talk) 08:38, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Okay, thanks. I haven't heard of the program I will have to give it a look. If anyone removes him again I will add him back. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 08:54, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

why do u keep removing week 1 suitcase nominations. they are valid nominations. just because they weren't for eviction doesn't mean they weren't nominations. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mikopale (talk • contribs) 02:02, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

It gives the inpression that they were nominations to evict, which they werent. In23065 (talk) 11:41, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

the nominations table isn't just for evictions. they're for all types of nominations. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.8.110.17 (talk) 01:01, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

No there not, who told you that. I am not going to change my mind but I will let you contribute if you promise not to add these nominations. In23065 (talk) 07:48, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

wot gives you the right to say wot goes on there over anybody else. and who told you that nominations were just for eviction. and also wot gives you the right to say who can contribute to this website and who can't. nominations are not just for evictions.

Please go away little child. In23065 (talk) 17:51, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

In23065 the suitcase nominations should be in the table, any twists like voting for who should return to the house, suitcase nominations, etc. should be included. A note was at the bottom of the table to inform readers that those were not nominations to evict rather votes for who shouldn't get their suitcase. Also your conduct with the editor replying isn't acceptable, sounds like you are having WP:OWN issues. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 20:14, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Thankyou Alucard. i think its about time in23065 should see he/she's wrong and you should appologise. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.19.65.78 (talk) 20:41, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

No I am not apologising and im going to make sure that the table is kept clean from irrelevant facts. In23065 (talk) 22:18, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Is that your purpose in life, to make sure that a nominations table stays in perfect condition. everywhere i see that you are updating things on wikipedia about big brother. do u do anything else with your life. and i dont mean that in a mean way. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.19.65.78 (talk) 00:54, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

In another unrelated issue, it seems you are changing parts of highly used, important templates (Template:Big Brother housemates and Template:Big Brother endgame) without having a proper discussion on the template's talk pages. Images that are 300px are way too big and have a very obvious presence in articles images of 137px-179px are good enough for the articles to get the point across. I would like to hear your point why articles need a high resolution logo instead of a lower resolution logo. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 04:47, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Hello, In23065/Archive. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 08:20, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Im not even going to answer to this, but can you please stop acting as if it was done automatically because i know you added me onto the list. In23065 (talk) 10:22, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

(Also copied to Alucard 16)

In23065, please note that anyone can edit articles, and disagreeing with you is not vandalism. Please read and understand our policies on civility and article ownership.

Both of you, please try to resolve content disputes on the article talk page, rather than reverting each other. Even if you don't go over the three-revert limit, you may still be blocked for disruptive editing.

EyeSerene^talk 13:29, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

I do not appreciate your uncivil comment, and the fact that you undid my edit and re-instated it, despite my wishes, was wholly inappropriate. Unless you wish to discuss your opinions with my civilly, I do not wish for you to post on my talk page (especially when you refer to me as a "bitch"). ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 17:18, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Your just a bit sour that I caught you talking about me behind my back and that is why I called you a bitch. So next time if you have a problem come and speak to me about it instead of bitching about be behind my back. In23065 (talk) 18:53, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sour about anything actually. I merely made observations, as I said, and was not "bitching" about you. It was completely uncalled for for you to call me a bitch, hence my removal of your message and comment here. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 18:57, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

EyeSerene^talk 19:38, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

So am I supposed to just let people mislead people viewing the page. In23065 (talk) 19:40, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

To answer your question simply - Yes... for now, at least. Is it really that important to protect your version of the article, even if you believe it's the only correct version? I have issued a similar block to the IP concerned, but if you hadn't made that last revert, you wouldn't have been blocked. To your credit, you started to talk things out on the article talk page, but then continued to revert the main article as well.

Wikipedia works by consensus - that is, coming to a group decision on disputed edits. The advantage of negotiating with other editors is that you may get a consensus for your edits, and then everyone should support you and help out when someone makes changes no-one agrees with. On the other hand, consensus may go against you, in which case we expect you to gracefully recognise that you aren't going to win and either support the rest of the group anyway, or find something else to work on. It's not easy, but it's how we do things. EyeSerene^talk 20:02, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

I don't think the consensus is against me it just the IP and one other member Alucard 16 and he think he is in charge of every Big Brother article and I even left for a month because I didn't want to put up with how he kept reverting all me edits. In23065 (talk) 20:08, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

User Alucard 16 has downgraded the article Big Brother 2004 (UK) through Talk:Big Brother 2004 (UK) giving it a C rather than a B. I see this as an attack on me meaning that the article does not deserve a B rating due to the fact that he does not agree with the table. He knows exactly what he is doing. In23065 (talk) 20:23, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Alucard has been altering the classifications of many articles, not just the Big Brother articles. It is not an attack on you because you do not own the article - if you are thinking you do, perhaps you need to move away from it and edit some other articles. I suggest you use your block time to read our guidelines regarding articles. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 20:33, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

In23065, C-Class is a new class for articles, I downgraded Big Brother 2004 (UK) not because of the table but because the article has an issue at the top about it "contradicts itself" and the fact it has very few reliable sources. The criteria for an article to be in B-Class was recently tightened and that is why I downgraded it and many other B-Class articles, I am also upgrading many Start Class articles that now meet the C-Class criteria. And regarding the table, as long as a record of the votes cast in either the table or weekly summary I am fine. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 20:45, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

In reply to In23065, the article talk page is the place to find out whether or not consensus really is on your side. If other editors fail to engage constructively, then you'll have made a good-faith effort, so you'll have a much stronger case in the future. I have to emphasise, though, that you need to be open to compromise too (no more comments like "I am not going to change my mind but I will let you contribute if you promise not to add these nominations."!) It also helps to suggest changes on talk pages before going ahead and making them, especially if they're big ones (like changing the logo, for example). Asking what other editors think before going ahead and doing it will give you a good idea of how well it's likely to go down. Your enthusiasm is great, and I understand that you've put a lot of work into these articles, but negotiation is a skill we all have to learn (as is accepting the fact that, sometimes, we might be wrong!)

Also, as the others have noted, C-Class has recently been introduced via a (really) long and tortuous community discussion, and most WikiProjects are currently having to reassess lots of their articles. It's nothing personal - perhaps you could regard it as an opportunity to improve the article to B-Class or even beyond. There seems to be plenty of help available! EyeSerene^talk 20:56, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Addendum: It's also worth mentioning that I was one of those who opposed the proposal for a C-Class... but I was on the 'losing' side, and now I have to work with it too. Consensus in action ;) EyeSerene^talk 20:59, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Also In23065, I have posted a complete list of all the articles I have downgraded from B-Class to C-Class on the project talk page with reasons why and most of the reasons why I downgraded the articles were pretty much the same either the article having warnings on the page or not enough reliable sources. It was nothing personal honest. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 21:31, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Hey. I just noticed that you've made a verbatim copy of my talk page layout on your own. While I don't mind that, I'd have appreciated a note on my talk page, and you should probably remove content that is specific to my own page from yours. Thanks. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 15:00, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me use it, What content is specific to your talk page? In23065 (talk) 15:02, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, the badges at the top were, but I think you've removed those now, so I think that was it. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 15:18, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

You should probably customise the colours of the badges at the top too - those colours were related to the text that was in the box. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 15:19, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

I just deleted Week 1 technically it is an entire different edit than what was made before. I am trying to work with you but the IP user is being stubborn. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 16:24, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

I see your point, add it back then. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 19:53, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your note. I did notice the IP had reverted you, and I've warned him and changed it back. I don't know if it's the same person as before, although I'm assuming it is, given the edits. It looks like you have pretty much come to an agreement now with most of the other editors (for which, well done), so if you're all acting to protect your consensus decision, it's okay to change the article back (be careful of getting into a new edit war though!). If the IP editor wants it done differently, he'll have to discuss it properly on the talk page. EyeSerene^talk 19:19, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, im 99% sure that it is the same person because both IPs don't know how to sign their posts. In23065 (talk) 19:32, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Done it again. In23065 (talk) 19:33, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

I saw the revert and I am sure it is, this is the third IP address to make the same edits on the article. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 19:35, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Would this be OK to put at the end of the discussion "

---

End of discussion, consensus agreed made. If anyone continues to revert they will be warned on their first revert and then banned if they continue to revert after that. In23065 (talk) 19:41, 8 July 2008 (UTC) "

No, it's either the whole page or nothing, although the levels of page protection can vary. As I said to Alucard though, page protection is always a last resort, and I've only agreed in this case because the disruptive IP has changed addresses, making blocking less effective. EyeSerene^talk 20:18, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Why did u delete my comment on the big brother 5 discussion page. Two can play at that game you know. Oh I do know how to sign on wikipedia but why should I.--92.21.163.125 (talk) 15:59, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

From now on im going to ignore you because you are like a little child the more attention you get the more you play up and throw your tantrums. In23065 (talk) 16:15, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Hi, How do you know me and why cant you just accept that Kitten was Evicted? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andybigbro2 (talk • contribs) 01:36, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

from ThisisBigBrother.com. In23065 (talk) 09:06, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, but who are you on that forum. And why cant you accept that Kitten WAS Evicted!Andybigbro2 (talk 17:21 10 July 2008 (UTC) In23065 (but i haven't been on for a long time). Anyway last week Davina said the "Jen will be ejected through those door" so I really think we need to address this and change it. In23065 (talk) 19:06, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Ahh you were banned on the forum. Right. And Davina was saying it as a figure of speech like she is ejected back to reality. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andybigbro2 (talk • contribs) 22:22, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Think about it Sensibly now Evicted = Being voted out by the public Ejected = Being voted out be Big Brother Walking = Leaving of your own accord Rejected = Housemates chose to evicted you (mainly just called an eviction) Now which does Kitten fall under. In23065 (talk) 22:29, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

No, Did you not see BBLB when it showed all the first evictees from each series? If The OFFICIAL Show counts her as being Evicted wikipedia should also. I do remember the "Kitten, you have been EVICTED. Please leave the Big Brother house" also. And to add. The Official Logo for Big Brother 5 is the red one. It signifies the "Evil" wich was the series tagline. The black one is the Template. Are you a fan of big brother? and do you even watch the show? It doesnt look like it to me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andybigbro2 (talk • contribs) 22:45, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes I did see that episode of BBLB and I do watch BB (I have watch every show from BB AU, UK and US). Right Although the show may of counted it as an eviction it was technically an Ejection and it is as simple as that. In23065 (talk) 22:51, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

But if the show Counts it as one, as should wikipedia. Its about information, not about "technically". If the show counts it as one then so should wikipedia. For someone who started to watch BB5 and see that Kitten was Evicted then come on wikipedia and get confused because it says that Kitten was Ejected. --Andybigbro2 (talk) 22:54, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

I don't want to fall out but saying that Kitten was evicted is technically false and there is nothing you can say or do that can change that. I'm saying this to you on a friendly basis that if you continue to say that she was evicted and revert people edits then the people with powers will ban you and to be honest i don't want to see that happen. In23065 (talk) 22:59, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Look. I am not trying to fall out either. but i just cant understand why we cant go by what the official show does. If wikipedia is a site for knowledge then it should be based in official knowledge. Not what people technically see it as. It was proven on this series of BBLb that Kitten does get counted as evicted by an official Spin-off show. Plus she was counted as evicted as the time BB5 was aired. --Andybigbro2 (talk) 23:05, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

If Channel 4 (and BBLB) said it was an eviction, then it was an eviction. It doesn't matter whether it is technically false or not - what Channel 4 says (which is the primary source in this matter) is what is true. ThisisBigBrother.com is a forum and is not a reliable source so does not count at all in this argument. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 23:06, 10 July 2008 (UTC) (PS: I have no interest in Big Brother - I am merely talking from a verifiable and reliable point of view.)

BBLB says a lot of things like a couple of weeks ago they were telling us that alex was the first person to walk in booed ever. At the end of the day, by saying it is an eviction gives the idea that the public voted to evict her at that's what it comes down to. In23065 (talk) 23:09, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

BBLB is as close to fact as you will get. Unfortunately you will have to live with what it says, despite what you may think or what may be truth. Unless you can find proper, reliable sources that are contrary to what BBLB is saying, then it will have to stand with what BBLB said. ~~ [Jam]^[talk] 23:11, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

It is misleading to say she was evicted and i think you will find the majorty are against you. In23065 (talk) 23:18, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Its misleading to have watched the show and seeing it as being called an Eviction, then coming on wikipedia to what its says otherwise. You can write on the wikipedia page about her that big brother evicted her. Big Brother could have evicted anyone that night. --Andybigbro2 (talk) 23:24, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Please Discus on the talk page before editing. BTW Big Brother was never planning to evict anyone that day. In23065 (talk) 23:26, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Please read this official Article http://www.channel4.com/entertainment/tv/microsites/B/bb5/news/newsstory7ba7.html --Andybigbro2 (talk) 23:26, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

I know Channel4 said she was but you need to get over it. Can we please end this conversation my hand ache. In23065 (talk) 23:30, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Sorry get over what? The truth?. If you know that they said it why cant you understand that it should be changed? It is counted as Evicted by the OFFICIAL show so it should do here. Not to what people technically see it as. As for Emma, she was counted as removed, if Kitten was Ejected she would too be counted as Removed, but she was counted as evicted.Andybigbro2 (talk) 23:34, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Two thing that C4 have said that go against the idea she was ejected: At Vanessa eviction Davina said "we have yet to have a proper eviction" and on the official website quiz one of the questions is "who was the first person to be ejected from the big brother 5 house" and the answer is Kitten. In23065 (talk) 23:38, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes, Proper eviction that doesnt mean Kitten's wasnt it just means that this time its back to normal. By saying proper eviction iut is still saying that kittens was an eviction just not the normal one we are used to. And can you post a screen cap on the quiz where it says that please? Andybigbro2 (talk) 23:45, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Ill go through the quiz to try and find that questions for you. In23065 (talk) 23:46, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Here we go first pic is the question http://i37.tinypic.com/2m6n1b5.jpg Second Pic is me getting the question right and the answer being kitten http://i34.tinypic.com/33nxaba.jpg. In23065 (talk) 23:53, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

I still belive that she was Evicted as more official things do than just a quiz. Plus i think youll fund the majority of true BB fans can see that she was Evicted.Andybigbro2 (talk) 00:00, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

I dont think so. I ask this in the C4 forum and I got a responce that everyone thought she was ejected. In23065 (talk) 00:10, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Show me the Post. Kitten was Official Evicted. Can you not understand something as simple as that? It should be changed as the Official Show states her as first evicted. If Vanessa was first evicted, her picture would have been on BBLB that day instead of Kittens Andybigbro2 (talk) 05:15, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Hi. I just saw this edit. If you want to request a CheckUser investigation, please go to WP:RFCU and follow the instructions there. In particular, please make sure to provide evidence for (a) why you think they are the same user and (b) why there is abuse going on. Thanks, Sam Korn ^(smoddy) 14:25, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. In23065 (talk) 14:36, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

You recently compiled and listed a case at requests for checkuser. A checkuser or clerk has requested you supply more information to justify the use of the checkuser procedure in the case, in accordance with the procedures listed in the table at the top of the requests for checkuser page. This has been implemented to reduce difficulties for checkusers, and is essential for your case to be processed. A link to your recently-created case which has this information missing is here. Thanks for your co-operation. -- lucasbfr ^talk 15:07, 10 July 2008 (UTC), checkuser clerk.

Note that I have moved your case to ist own subpage Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/Mavis789. -- lucasbfr ^talk 15:07, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Hey In23065, the way you set up the table for America's Player doesn't make sense since the AP twist will run for one week this time instead of the whole season. There are five tasks, CBS even says so so having the first one as task 1 with the rest as task 1.2, 1.3, etc. doesn't make sense and makes the rest look like parts of task 1. You need to quit changing tables and then wanting people to discuss changes. I am changing it back to the original form and you should suggest your major change and explain why on the talk page, if a consensus is reached to do it the way you suggested then fine but the table should match BB8's as much as possible. Also don't post future votes, there will be four votes this week but there are three episode. CBS terms & rules states there is a nomination vote, eviction vote, and two fun votes. So wait for the broadcasts before adding. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 02:02, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

From what I understand they will be a new player every week and the votes inside that week related to the first vote of that week. In23065 (talk) 11:53, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Where did you hear that? And think wouldn't it defeat the purpose of America's Player to have a different one next week, because then the house will be aware of the twist. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:04, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Im sure I heard it on the show. Anyway if there is a new player next week then we can change the table back to my way then. In23065 (talk) 23:28, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Don't make edits like this. You know they will be reverted, we haven't even had today's eviction. If Davina announces it tonight (which she may) then feel free to add it but you may want to find a ref for it. Darrenhusted (talk) 14:59, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Believe what you like but in a couple of day that will be back there. In23065 (talk) 15:11, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

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I don't understand your constant revert on The Simple Life article. The statement is that viewers compared the two, the forum sourced shows this opinion; I am not stating "Producers said this is an unnoficial remake of The Simple Life" in any way, nor do I need to; it was a valid opnion held by many. I am reinstating it and adding several other sources this time, I don't understand why you are so against the comparison. Blaedvanderwoodsen (talk) 08:44, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

I reverted your edits to Big Brother (TV series) which are about Dead Set. Dead Set is a drama/fictional spin-off of Big Brother UK and should not be included in the "Big Brother series" table. Also I believe there was a discussion about Dead Set already and that it should be regulated to the BB UK page not the overall Big Brother page. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 17:41, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

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Hi, I reverted your edits to I'm a Celebrity... Get Me out of Here! (Series 8 UK) because they were uncited. If you could provide a link to a news article where this is stated, I will re-insert the changes you made. Sorry for any inconvenience, however at a time where there is much anticipation about what happens in this programme, we must make sure that everything can be verified. Thanks Jinxed - talk 11:05, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

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Please do not add original research or novel syntheses of previously published material to our articles as you apparently did to Big Brother 2009 (UK). Please cite a reliable source for all of your information. Thank you. Dale 07:07, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

Template:Im A Celebrity has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. — This, that, and the other (talk) 10:58, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Hi. Please do not upload large copyrighted files to Wikipedia, as you did with the Real World: Las Vegas cast photo. Images used under a claim of Fair Use should not exceed 300px in height or width. In addition, the smaller photo bears the show's logo, making it more explanatory as the article's main Infobox image. Thanks. Nightscream (talk) 20:38, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

Awesome job with the screengrabs for Real World seasons.

Quick requests though: Can you do the same for Road Rules? You can get screenshots of each season's logo from http://www.mtv.com/videos/misc/128344/road-rules-2007-viewers-revenge-trailer.jhtml . It may take a few times with pausing. Semester at Sea already has one on Wiki but it may worth getting a better screenshot that doesn't have Veronica's hair covering her face. South Pacific should be easier to grab from the video at http://www.blind.com/work/broadcast-design/road-rules/ (grab from the video, the static one on the page uses the season's working title. It'd also be great to take a static RR logo for its main page such as the one at http://www.mm-agency.com/mtv-road-rules/road-rules.jpg.

If you're looking for logos of all seasons of The Challenge, they appear in the beginning of episode 1 of Rivals. They flash by REALLY fast though so it'd take some time to pause and get em all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Roadie01 (talk • contribs) 07:17, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:34, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 5 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:35, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 13 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:35, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 8 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:35, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 24 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:35, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 23 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:36, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 19 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:36, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 25 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:36, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 12 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:37, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 14 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:38, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 20 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:38, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 18 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:38, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 3 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:39, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Real World 6 title.jpeg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

PLEASE NOTE:

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• I will remove the request for deletion if the file is used in an article once again.
• If you receive this notice after the image is deleted, and you want to restore the image, click here to file an un-delete request.
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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 05:39, 26 November 2011 (UTC)