User:Falastur2/Prem 07-08 afd

To anyone reading this out of context - unlikely though I think that is - this is a rather-long reply to an AFD debate on the Premier League 2008-09 article. I recommend you read that before reading this.

I've read the Wikiguidelines on crystal-balling several times, including a couple of minutes ago to double-check my assertions, and I am near-certain that there is no crystal-balling here. What there is is a list which is being completed as the current season progresses and thus makes information certain of the teams which are guaranteed survival in the Premier League for next season. Please note that we have adamantly stuck by the no-crystal-balling mantra ourselves and removed inclusions of teams who have not yet made certain their survival, keeping only those who have absolutely no mathematical chance of relegation. What's more, I remind you that WP:CRYSTAL specifically states that future sporting events and the like may be added in this way if, and I quote:

"Individual scheduled or expected future events should only be included if the event is notable and almost certain to take place...Examples of appropriate topics include the 2010 U.S. Senate elections and 2016 Summer Olympics."

If we can include the 2016 Summer Olympics (and I remind you that there are still two Olympic Games to be held before the 2016 Games) as an article, I see no plausible explanation why we cannot have the 2008-09 Premier League - it certainly is notable, and it is arguably just as likely to occur as the 2008 Olympics, let alone the 2016...maybe more likely, in view of the current political crisis surrounding China and the Games. As to why to make an article about next season's Premier League - why, it is in the very nature of English football, indeed European and much of world football, to be focused on the next season, and that is a crucial reason why this article is important. A fundamental, perhaps the fundamental, aspect of English football is not fighting for placement in your league at the end of the season - even winning a league is actually a very short-term achievement - but the implications it has on your team for the following season. It's part of why promotion and relegation makes the leagues so competitive - because virtually every step of the way through the whole season, long after you may fall out of contention for the title of champions of your league, you still have to fight to ensure you aren't in the relegation zone, as this means a lower standard of football next season, less profits, etc. In the Premier League there is the added complication of European competitions which makes up for the lack of promotion places in the top flight. If you look into all the football journalism for the Premier League at virtually any point of the season, even very early on, the questions asked, the predictions made, etc are not who will win but where everyone will finish, because league finish affects what happens to you next season. The focus on next season is hugely apparent if you follow football - from when Paul Jewell took over the now-relegated Derby County in November of 2007...that's not even half-way through the season...he was saying that Derby were virtually assured of relegation, and that his job for the season was in fact going to be to prepare the club for next season. In fact, the same is now true for many more clubs - if you look at the various media articles for my own team, Man City, for example, who still face a real chance of European qualification, then maybe 50% of what you will find is journalism about what Sven-Goran Eriksson plans to do to the team over summer to make them more ready next season. If you read the BBC website's football page, weeks ago they were writing speculative articles on who will be in the Premier League next season, because that's where the focus of the Championship clubs with promotion potential is - they don't really care about their league, so much as they care about being in the Premier League next season, and the supporters feel the same. If you watch Match of the Day, or any other football program, arguably the bigger debates aren't on who will win the league but who will survive relegation and who will qualify for Europe, because a team's status next season is what they aspire to. If you ask most fans, even the most committed, where their team was at the end of last season, most can't remember, many don't care, because league placement ultimately really doesn't matter to us so much as what it means for our clubs next season. In many ways, the minds of Premier League fans is already half off this season, as we begin discussions over our future in the next season. And that is why I think that having this article is important - it helps us to visualise the next season, our real focus. I apologise for writing so much by the way, but I do have something of a tendency to make a fully-argued point...