User talk:M.Billoo2000: Difference between revisions

Welcome!

Hello, M.Billoo2000, and welcome to Wikipedia! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

• The five pillars of Wikipedia
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Since you've shown some interest in editing topics related to Pakistan, we hope you'll stay and add content to Pakistan-related articles. Pakistani topics are generally underrepresented on Wikipedia and you can help counter this imbalance by becoming a regular contributor and by joining or watchlisting Pakistan-related discussions (for example, Notice board for Pakistan-related topics). Again, welcome!

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or click here to ask a question on your talk page. Mar4d (talk) 17:43, 6 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unless we get a source that the feed has been restored, we can't source it and place it in the article. Nate • (chatter) 06:01, 7 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Mrschimpf:! You've mentioned about website, "The network's website remains up, but makes no mention of the suspension", the website was not opening last week, but since I messaged you, the website is also opening. M.Billoo2000 (talk) 08:17, 7 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Mrschimpf:! There's no reference I've found for the re-opening of network, but it is now broadcasting on television, showing original contents and it's official website. Please update. Also, update "Urdu-dubbed" into "Hindi-dubbed", and the controversy was also created due to airing Hindi-dubbed programs. Hope for your kind responce. Thanks! M.Billoo2000 (talk) 10:15, 8 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, we need a source from neutral media or PEMRA that the network's license has been restored; 'I saw it on TV' can't be counted as a source. Even though they've posted to Facebook, that can easily be automated, which I have a feeling is how that's being updated. And the website is 404'ing; that's pretty much the most obvious sign nothing has been resolved. Nate • (chatter) 23:13, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Once again, nothing from PEMRA has been issued, so the status has to remain unchanged. The website might be up too but I'm seeing nothing different from it pre-suspension. Nate • (chatter) 22:59, 1 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mrschimpf: Hi! How a "suspended channel" could air 2017 Kids' Choice Awards? Not only this, NickPak had a repeat telecast too. Again, it's an official facebook page for NickPak, see official website too which is not "404'ing" here, but it has not updated since July 2015 (I don't know why, or if it would have country locks or something too, like Cartoon Network Pak).

¿("Even though they've posted to Facebook, that can easily be automated, which I have a feeling is how that's being updated." […] "Facebook remains up but with no mentions of the suspension, and the only updates being to their profile image, possibly automated.")?

Also, talk about PEMRA's official twitter page, they didn't have updated the info about it. There is no other new news for the channel, but Awards show 2017's airing. Maybe poor sources, still hope these will help. M. Billoo 14:51, 10 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mrschimpf: Hi! Now this (in update of this) is what you were asking for, you always wanted. The network is not closed, had been officially confirmed by PEMRA too. You were ignoring this matter, and your sentence I quoted above ("Even though [……] possibly automated.") is not verified. Please correct and update now, because I know you will not let me or anyone do this, as you've also said (wrong), "discussion closed". Thanks! M. Billoo 10:06, 16 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mrschimpf: Why are you not giving response? Now see the news reported here by Dunya News and here by Dawn (newspaper), and still if you don't (want to) believe, then I will correct it myself. You want(ed) update from PEMRA, you were asking for solid source, so I have now given you. Please update now, thanks! M. Billoo 08:08, 18 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I apologize for not coming back to this; I haven't really had time to look at this issue lately and there's been other aspects of Wikipedia I've been working on, especially vandal patrol. But I'm looking at the PEMRA documents and I don't know if they're commenting on a violation from this year or last year; the Winx Club complaint is undated about when the incident took place itself (I'm seeing a notice date, but not when the episode aired to determine if the channel returned from suspension or not). If I had a date that would be an easy call. And as for the Facebook issue I'm still seeing no proof that this is someone posting for real or if they're just running on an automated schedule. We can't use Nickalive as a source because it's just distributing Nick's publicity materials without editorial control. If I have more proof that it's returned then I can say it's back in operation. But for now, I'm still skeptical. Nate • (chatter) 06:50, 19 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mrschimpf: Hi, Thanks! It's actually written in here, episode 'The Emperor' was aired on 27 April 2017 at 3:00pm. M. Billoo 06:56, 19 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you...and I've dug around and finally found a source that said the suspension was stayed months ago, so I'm re-adding the numbers in now. Apologies for the difficulty; trying to ascertain everything going on with Pakistani TV seems to be amplified now with PEMRA taking a more hands-on role. Nate • (chatter) 09:02, 20 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Summaries of critical response

Hi M.Billoo, re: this, summaries of critical response need to come from specific voices from reliable sources. So you'd have to find a source like IBT or TOI that says, "the film received mixed reviews". Otherwise, editors could just find a bunch of negative reviews, stuff them into the article, then describe the overall critical response as negative. We can't cherrypick reviews, then try to interpret how all editors felt based on those selected reviews. Hope that makes sense. Regards, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 01:02, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@Cyphoidbomb: Hi! Sorry for that edit. I didn't got "IBT", but I think it's International Business Times. Well, this news from The Times of India says, "The movie,..., has also received largely positive reviews." Is this source workable for there or not? Thanks! (is this design for sign. correct here?) M. Billoo 15:29, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Burying negative reviews?

Hi M.Billoo, re: this, I'm curious why you're reordering reviews in descending rating order. I feel like I may have asked about this at Dear Zindagi or one of the other articles. This tends to look like we're burying negative reviews so that nobody sees them. It seems very weird to me. I suppose I can understand it a little more if a film was widely praised and there is simply insufficient negative reviews to populate the bulk of the section, but for a film with mixed response, or even a film that was received poorly, this automatic ordering by rating seems counterproductive and a bit promotional. Just a thought. Thanks. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 20:02, 20 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Admin! Sorry, as I am new here. I think the descending arrangement on Dear Zindagi was not done by me, I had put them randomly. It was arranged by some one else ([1]). As in Ae Dil Hai Mushkil, I had put them randomly too, but then arranged as was in Dear Zindagi. Really sorry if it does not seem good. I think you're talking about this, where you've said, "Section is supposed to be coherently-assembled prose, not bullet-points with bells and whistles." I didn't find any source (as you've earlier said that see IBT or TOI for Dear Zindagi) that confirms review summary for ADHM.

If it makes bad impression on both articles, then I would like to try to arrange randomly... But I really need guidance ([2]), Thanks! M. Billoo 07:28, 21 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

One more thing, "Box office" and "Critical response" should be sub-sections of "Release", shouldn't be? M. Billoo 07:35, 21 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think there's a hard rule on that. Sometimes you'll find box office in a reception section. See Mad Max: Fury Road. Sometimes box office gets covered in Release with no sub-section. See Hellraiser: Bloodline. It really depends on what makes the most sense for that particular article. We typically use sub-sections when there is sufficient content do so. If all we have are three sentences on release, domestic gross and international gross, then sub-sections don't really sense. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 15:57, 23 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Admin! Thanks for updating! I thought it would be a rule, when you did arrangement on Dear Zindagi. M. Billoo 18:46, 23 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Quotation refactoring

Hi M.Billoo, regarding these changes, it's important that you understand the rules of how to include quotations in English prose. We can't just pull out sections of a quotation without making some indication that we've made changes to it, and especially when it may fundamentally change the meaning of what the person said. So for example, in this quotation if you wanted to remove a portion from the middle:

"The best way to enjoy Raees then is to manage expectations first. This is an uneven film. In places, you will applaud and whistle. But you might also find yourself utterly exhausted."

We still have to indicate that we've removed it, by using ellipses like this:

"The best way to enjoy Raees then is to manage expectations first. ... In places, you will applaud and whistle. But you might also find yourself utterly exhausted."

You could also do it like:

"The best way to enjoy Raees then is to manage expectations first." Ray also felt the film was uneven, commenting, "In places, you will applaud and whistle. But you might also find yourself utterly exhausted."

In this quote though, I don't see why we'd remove the observation that the reviewer felt the film was uneven, that seems directly tied to the rest of the observation.

Re: this quote:

"While the film is engaging, what lets it down are some of the contrived and ridiculous twists in the second half. But the climax packs a punch and that misgiving — 'where is this film going?' — is erased."

I don't think it was a good idea to remove "in the second half", because that fundamentally changes the meaning of the quotation. If the second half was bad in the reviewer's opinion, removing that specific information will now make the reader think that the entire film was bad.

Lastly, there are times when we have to change a quotation so that it makes sense grammatically, or to fix an ambiguity in the language so that we know who we're talking about. In those cases, we use square brackets [ ] to indicate a portion has been changed. For example, let's assume someone said the following about Raees:

Smith wrote, "It lacked energy and his attention to detail was weak."

From that selected quote, a reader doesn't know what "it" is or who "his" is, so we'd fix that by writing:

Smith wrote, "[The film] lacked energy and [Dholakia's] attention to detail was weak."

This way, we have fully disclosed to the reader that we modified a direct quotation for some reason. I hope some of this helps. If you're still not sure of how to do this, I urge you to find a grammar website that helps, or maybe there are some YouTube videos that can help with direct quotations. This is an important academic skill to have. Thanks, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 17:50, 5 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for copy editing Shahid Masood page. Saqib (talk) 14:41, 8 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Saqib: You're welcome! Actually, thanks to you, you are working on the page and I am just doing nothing...... M. Billoo 14:47, 8 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

As you reverted my edit for the colour scheme change, how do you suggest we fix Lahore's team colours? Peshawar's colours are also incorrect as the colours should be flipped around.

Thanks. - ProdigyUpdates (talk) 17:54, 12 February 2017 (GST)

@ProdigyUpdates: Hi! As for the edit you are talking, I undid saying it "a nice edit". Means you were right and your edit was right too. But, there is a need to update the template {{Cr-PSL}}. I am also a new user here, and I don't know how to edit templates, but we can make requests on Template talk:Cr-PSL. Thanks! M. Billoo 14:07, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. You drew my attention to List of anthems about Pakistan Super League recently.

To be honest, it's not really my sort of article. It does highlight that each team seems to be creating new anthems for each season - is that the case do you think? I plan on overhauling the team pages again once the league is finished for the year and it would be useful to know if this is the case. I'd also like people to think about moving the detail of the 2017 season to season articles - as Islamabad United in 2016 for example. That will let us take some of the masses of detail out of the individual season.

As well as that, the draft articles could use some work. I've mentioned this on the 2017 draft talk page - could you tell me your thoughts there about that idea?

With regard to the anthems article, I think it might be better to name it List of anthems of the Pakistan Super League. I *think* that would be a slightly better English language name - perhaps the article can be moved to that name? I think it has some mileage and it's a useful holding page for this sort of information if they really are going to release new songs each year.

I'd be keen to know your thoughts in general. Blue Square Thing (talk) 18:03, 26 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Blue Square Thing: Hi! Thanks for your kind response. Hmm... I too agree, page name should be like that; "of" instead of "about". Earlier, we've discussed that anthems' info should be on individual team / league articles instead of main (like in '2017 Pakistan Super League' instead of main 'Pakistan Super League', because they might be creating several new anthems each year and page will go long only by mentioning song names. But then I think that all the anthems should be listed together too. Should I move?

As I am saying on most of my edit summaries that (for example) 'Karachi Kings in 2017' article coming soon, similar as 'Karachi Kings in 2016', you are right for moving the info in new page. Shall we (other good users too) start working?

I saw your message on PSL draft 2017, you asked about order of picking players. You also said that it should be arranged in PSL draft 2016 page. I agree that too, but it is hard for me to arrange. I am unable to find any news reference for that, but soon will try as I can. PSL has officially shared 2017 video, but not of 2016. Well, you have put forward a good point, thanks again! M. Billoo 21:08, 26 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Blue Square Thing and Mar4d: Another point I want to raise is teams' colour scheme given in Wiki. Template:Cr-PSL should be updated, showing accurate colour schemes of every team in every year. Like for Lahore Qalandars in 2016 colour was "black base with red stripes", but for 'Lahore Qalandars in 2017', it is "green base with dark bluish stripes" (this is what I understand, it might be any other dark colour). Template should be used as {{Cr-PSL|lhr2016}} for old and {{Cr-PSL|lhr}} for latest. Next year, this one 'might' become {{Cr-PSL|lhr2017}} and new one {{Cr-PSL|lhr}}. This might take a long time to work, but it might help too. Hope I have cleared, sorry for my weak English. M. Billoo 18:39, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I get what you're saying. Though I'm not entirely sure how to do it. Obviously the template will require the addition of a parameter that allows it to display the themes used in a season. As far as I know, Lahore were the only team that changed their kit. It can be done but you may need to ask a template expert to make the necessary changes. Mar4d (talk) 18:56, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Also, some of those colours are done poorly and may need to be refined. In the Karachi and Peshawar colours for example, the lines don't look straight. And Quetta's strip doesn't look gold. Mar4d (talk) 18:57, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mar4d: You're right, only LQ's color was changed. I earlier had left a message on Template Talk:Cr-PSL but didn't get reply, instead I saw updated version in most of the pages. Also, team IU color should be interchanged. Thanks! M. Billoo 19:04, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

So now we need two people. A template expert and a graphics expert :p Mar4d (talk) 19:05, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mar4d, Anjana Larka, and Wiki id2: I saw these 2 users' contributions on Template:Cr-PSL, maybe they can help. Also, I edited color on KK and LQ's fan userboxes, if they are correct then I would liketo say that all 5 should be similar. M. Billoo 19:14, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I'm lousy with graphics templates (OK, lousy means bad). I don't particularly use them (or like them if I'm honest) so I might take a look if you guys can't get it sorted.

I think I have sources for the 2016 draft probably - CricInfo has some decent articles that will let us patch things together a little better anyway. In terms of the yearly articles, why don't you start them and I'll weight in at some point and try and rationalise them and deal with any written English stuff. The pages we developed for Kent County Cricket Club in 2016 might also be worth a look in terms of some of the ways in which the game logs themselves have been done. I'm not a fan of the tables on the PSL ones from last year. Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:37, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Karachi vs. Lahore

What are your thoughts on the famous Karachi Kings–Lahore Qalandars rivalry. Apart from the hype that pervades whenever these two sides meet, I have gone through a selection of sources from the two seasons along with the TV ratings. I am convinced that it could become a decent article. Mar4d (talk) 13:23, 6 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mar4d: Hi! I was too thinking of this... As the both cities; Karachi and Lahore, are also facing some political fights (in development and other things), but the biggest reason I think is the TV rating fight between two media groups; ARY (of Karachi Kings) and Geo (of Lahore Qalandars).

If you are on facebook, you might see many posts that the two cities are fighting; Khi says that it has sea and Lhr says that it has rain (seasonal and weather fights). These are two largest cities of Pakistan, and the strict 'muqabla' between the citizens is due to that which city is better (developed) large (I think :D).

Also, LQ is the second most expensive team after KK, maybe 'it' is due to this jealousy that who proves to be more expensive, hahaha... Or the both teams might be thinking that they would get stronger by having strong player like Gayle, who proved to be best in IPL, and as he has played for both the teams here (maybe the reason of 'rivalry' is his 'sorry work' in PSL).

Sorry for the late reply, as I was busy on something else. Well, I will try to search and collect some more points soon, but one question is that why this wiki-article has been deleted? Earlier I was notified that it was redirected to "Ab Khel Jamay Ga", but was then restored... Thanks! :) M. Billoo 18:31, 6 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, you raise some interesting points. It is my understanding that as both cities dominate the cricket structures in Pakistan, there also tend to be other issues like one city's players supposedly getting 'preferential treatment' over the other. This of course dates back to the Imran Khan-Javed Miandad era. It would be interesting to explore some of these points within the context of the rivalry, with reliable references of course. I will work on this over the next few days. Mar4d (talk) 18:50, 6 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hi M.Billoo2000, Glad to meet you. Eh, the reason I removed them from Wikipedia is the fact they are illegal on WP. They point to user generated content which is outside editorial control. Anything that is not under editorial control is not allowed. That included, facebook, youtube, blogger, linked in, all social media sites, personnel blogs and so on. scope_creep (talk) 23:34, 16 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Also I meant to say, it is a form of advertising, which is also not allowed, per WP:NOTADVERTISING. It is using WP as a host to advertise a product. scope_creep (talk) 23:41, 16 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Scope creep: Hi! Thanks for your kind response, I understand what you say. Is there any need to prove through refs the film soundtracks and Coke Studio, because they are already linked to article? And which songs need to be proved by refs? By the way, I was already working on page's code to add some more info about lyricist, musicians and some more refs, which will take some time. Thanks! M. Billoo 00:18, 17 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

WP:NOT is worth taking a looking. scope_creep (talk) 00:37, 17 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Scope creep: A few days back, I was notified that Sadads has reviewed my-created-page Rahat Fateh Ali Khan discography. But he didn't said anything about YouTube or other refs. Similarly I have put in Atif Aslam discography, but no one said anything. Just wanted to let you know. M. Billoo 13:18, 17 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hi I didn't do a deep review of the quality of the content, I only reviewed whether or not I think the article is reasonably notable and thus warrants inclusion in the encyclopedia. Sadads (talk) 22:34, 19 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hi M.Billoo2000, Can you take the youtube references out of this please, and any other article which you have written. Thanks. scope_creep (talk) 00:48, 17 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Scope creep: Why have you removed music video names, you were only talking about refs. Can I re-add names only, they were official. Well, I will try to find more refs. Please, Thanks! M. Billoo 00:55, 17 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry about that. I must have deleted them by accident.scope_creep (talk) 01:08, 17 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Scope creep: Hi! See this edit by Admin Materialscientist, they didn't say anything about YouTube refs on page Atif Aslam. So, I am putting back some official refs on the pages I removed on your message; 'Ali Zafar discography' and its subpages. Thanks! M. Billoo 05:07, 28 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hi M., you have put a whole bundle of youtubes ref back in, on the word of somebody who clearly doesn't understand WP:NPP. These are illegal reference types of Wikipedia. Please take them out. If you keep adding illegal content you will be blocked. Any user generated content, that has not been fact checked by an editorial board, is considered illegal on Wikipedia. You have used a assertion by another editor who is page reviewer, who doesn't know the correct policies to push your own viewpoint, which is considered disruptive. Please fix it immediately. And can you take them out on any other article you have done. scope_creep (talk) 10:29, 28 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Scope creep: Hi! If you are warning me, it's OK. Let us first not talk about I PoVs. Earlier, I had a talk with Admin Cyphoidbomb too, he said that adding official YouTube refs is allowed. If there is any doubt on which is un-official, so it can be removed, but not official ones. It's not what I am saying by myself, Thanks! M. Billoo 10:39, 28 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You could be right. I have tended to apply blanket bang, but do need a link to see what it is. I have kicked it up to an admin, see what he says. Can you fix the bare urls. See when you edit, you will see a cite button on the bar. When you click on it, it has some drop downs on the left hand side, cite book, cite news, cite web. It open a dialog, that when you fill in the fields, creates a proper ref. Better than fields of bare urls which need to be fixed by somebody else later. scope_creep (talk) 10:49, 28 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

scope_creep (talk) 10:49, 28 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Scope creep: Verified YouTube channels for established reliable sources are typically OK. If CNN has a YouTube presence (for example), that would be OK. In contrast, since the community doesn't consider Koimoi a reputable source, (for example) linking to a verified Koimoi YouTube video would typically not be ideal if the content was controversial. The two things we're concerned about are linking to potential copyright violations and linking to poor references. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 13:56, 29 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Salaam Aleikum M.Billoo2000! Can u make an article about song Main Laila Main search and find please info about 1980 version and 2017 film version an find please cover of this song 2017 in iTunes, which pictured Sunny Leone? If you make this article, I will be grateful! Thank you! --217.66.152.214 (talk) 12:02, 30 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

W.S. You can make it too. :) M. Billoo 21:51, 30 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

High-budget Pakistani films

See this. A Pakistani list would be nice, though some solid references would be good to start off. I've read in multiple sources that Yalghaar is the most expensive Pakistani film made in terms of its budget. This is quite interesting, and I wouldn't be surprised if future films have similar budgets. Let me know your thoughts. Mar4d (talk) 11:30, 9 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mar4d: Hi! Many Pakistani filmmakers don't like to reveal their film budget, for example see this and this. I have found only names to be top 5, atleast as of now:

*2017: Yalghaar est. Rs. 50 crore

*TBA: Nation Awakes est. Rs. 20–25 crore

*2014: Sultanat est. Rs. 22 crore

*2013: Waar est. Rs. 17 crore

*2014: O21 est. Rs. 10 crore

It's hard to find many info about a Pakistani film but info about Bollywood films are reported by many major news sources. The list I mentioned is may be known to you too, or might be I have missed some, but rest films known to me go below it.

I would say we have to wait until we have proper info of atleast 15 films above Rs. 10 crore expense. After it, timeline sub-heading could be created too. Still I don't mind if the page is created now, but I think we have less info to share right now. M. Billoo 22:00, 9 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hi...I noticed you're part of the Pakistani cinema task force. I've fixed quite a bit up on the Cinema of Pakistan article and the template. However, one thing I'm noticing is there is lack of emphasis being made on which industry is producing what. Cinema of Pakistan actually has around 5 industries:

• Lahore cinema industry (Lollywood)
• Karachi cinema industry (Kariwood)
• Pashto cinema (revival in progress with some new films)
• Sindhi cinema (collapsed, revival being planned)
• Balochi cinema (collapsed, hasn't revived yet)

There's a few problems I'd like to highlight:

• First is the lack of differentiating between "Lollywood" and Pakistani cinema. Lollywood exclusively means Lahore cinema industry so I don't understand why some Urdu films being produced in Karachi are being called "Lollywood" films. This would be like an English film being produced in the UK and it being called "Hollywood". I think we should make an effort clearly highlight the difference.

• Pashto cinema has actually been making quite a few number of films now but they are not highlighted in the "List of Pakistani films for (insert year here)". Or maybe I missed it.

Let me know what you think. --PAKHIGHWAY (talk) 01:22, 24 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@PAKHIGHWAY: Hi! It will take time for me to work on it due to lack of info, thanks for sharing. I thought I had replied, but it seems some internet problem due to which message was not sent. I am saving it in my reminders' list, hope you understand, Thanks! M. Billoo 14:45, 26 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@PAKHIGHWAY:: My two cents on your first question. I think it's a misconception that "Lollywood" only applies to Lahore cinema. It of course has its roots in Lahore, but it is generally identified as the national/mainstream cinema of Pakistan. An equivalent would be Bollywood which, although centred in Mumbai, is considered the mainstream cinema of India. There was of course a period in the 1980s when Lollywood resorted to Punjabi films and hence it picked up a more regional identity. But that has changed as Urdu films are back. The Kariwood article seems to be more about the local filming scene in Karachi. It's like having an article on the Islamabad filming scene which created movies like Slackistan. By and large, the national industry for Urdu and Punjabi films is still Lollywood, and most reliable sources attest to that, in addition to Pakistani film awards, industry people and the self-identification used during marketing of films. Mar4d (talk) 15:07, 3 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mar4d and PAKHIGHWAY: As far as I know, current films after Khuda Kay Liye are not under Lollywood title, they are just Pakistani films. So our national industry is Pakistani film industry. Indian people like to use and say the word Bollywood, which I have noticed after editing some Indian film articles, but then I had a conversation here. We can take a look at interviews of Ali Zafar, Fawad Khan and similar who have worked in both the cinemas for some further information that what title is used where. Similarly, India has not only Bollywood, they have other language ---woods too. M. Billoo 15:57, 3 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mar4d and M.Billoo2000: I understand where you're coming from, however all of the newer films being produced (Urdu productions) that are making a huge statement are mainly in Karachi now. Lahore hasn't really produced a meaningful Urdu film in ages now. In fact the last meaningful Urdu films to come out of Lahore were Khuda Kay Liye and Bol, both of which were produced by Shoman Productions (Shoaib Mansoor's company, based in Lahore). If we look at the List of highest-grossing Pakistani films, almost all of them are Karachi based productions. Jawani Phir Nahi Ani by Six Sigma Plus (Karachi), Bin Roye by MD Films (Karachi), Waar by MindWorks Media (Islamabad), Wrong No. by YNH Films (Karachi), Actor In Law by Filmwala Pictures (Karachi), Janaan by IRK Films (Islamabad), Ho Mann Jaan by The Vision Factory (Karachi), Lahore Se Aagay by Showcase Productions (ironically Karachi based), Choorian (1998) by Pak Nishan Films (Lahore), Bol by Shoman Productions (Lahore). So out of the top 10 highest grossing Pakistani films, 6 are Karachi based productions, 2 Islamabad and 2 Lahore. All of the 6 Karachi productions were released between 2013 to 2017. I think it's suffice and safe to assume that Karachi has rightfully taken its position as the leader in Urdu cinema. Lahore still makes films, but they're almost exclusively Punjabi films. They tried producing some Urdu films over the years, and they were utter disasters. Islamabad is an oddity, but I view them as an extension of Karachi's scene. And there also seems to be an emphasis from Karachi based producers to not use the term "Lollywood"...it's almost like they deliberately do it, and to be honest I cannot blame them. At the same time does the Karachi scene identity with the "Kariwood", that I'm not sure about...but I do know for a fact that Lahore and Karachi are indeed two different camps. --PAKHIGHWAY (talk) 16:43, 4 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Why are you removing my content, I have noticed and ignored one too many times, I was very much open to edits you were making. But you dont get to owned page. "I know how to edit too", specially the coke Studio, and dont be oversmart and over write my edits from now own. This is unacceptable just because you dont like it, you cant change or overwrite what was already written and was actually right. I will see it next time, as I have ignored you on multiple occasions. Nauriya (Rendezvous) 7:28, 8th August,2017 UTC.

@Nauriya: Hi! First tell me the reason that why you people are not discussing here? There was again not only one reason of changing the content you added;

• When you created the page, you added there Template:Use dmy dates, but you yourself were not adding the dates in this format, which I also told you on your talk page.
• On 14 August 2017, Pakistan will celebrate its 71st independence day on turning 70 years old. The first independence day was celebrated on 14 August 1947, it was not 0th (zero-th). As if a kid turns 1, it would be his second birthday.
• Once again, you added critic's comment without mentioning the name that who said it, which I also told you on your talk page. I then further added two more critics' comments; more can also be added.
• OK, tell the meaning of this,
  "As a part of series regular the season was introduced by a rendition of "Qaumi Taranah", sung by this years featured artistes on 4th August to celebrate the 70th Independence of country."
  My english is weak, but not too much. I added in similar of what has been written on YouTube by CS, "To 70 years of Pakistan", not "To celebrate 70th71st independence day..." If your continuity be like this, it would be better,
  "As a part of series regular, the season was introduced on 4 August by a rendition of "Qaumi Taranah", sung by this year's the featured artistes on 4th August to celebrate the 70th 71st Iindependence of the country."
• "The rendition of the anthem received mixed reviews from media outlets", this line was totally unsourced.
• One more thing which I also mistaken, Release section should come after Production section.

In reply of your "I will see it next time, as I have ignored you on multiple occasions", yes you are right! You were ignoring me, and my messages in talk pages. You only replied two times even you said "I am busy", but you know how many times I messaged you? Three of your made CS subcategories have been deleted and you have not given any response, which I also messaged you. Two more CS-related categories are in WP:Cfd, waiting for final decision. So if you are ignoring my edits, keep ignoring as it is your problem not mine, because I try not to ignore anyone. I mostly try to give short explanation of my edits. (Please remember to sign your posts on talk pages by typing four keyboard tildes like this: ~~~~. Or, you can use the [ reply ] button, which automatically signs posts.), instead of copy-paste or doing something else. Hope I have made you understand what I am saying, Thanks! M. Billoo 12:00, 8 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

		The Special Barnstar
		I undid the wrong edit. I did not mean to undo that edit. Please accept my apology. So said The Great Wiki Lord. (talk) 13:02, 12 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]