Talk:Moira Deeming: Difference between revisions

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I would like to know why some person seemns to have the right, to blatantly spread misinformation about Moira Deeming, a member of the Liberal Party in the State of Victoria Australia. She is accused of holding an "anti trans rally", when it was NOT. It was a rally for woman's safety and was titles "Let Women Speak" . There have been numerous attempts tro rectify this and make the article on Deeming more accurate yet this lie about the rally seems to perpetuate? Skyfox Gazelle (talk) 03:39, 10 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This has been discussed many, many times if you care to look through the talk archives (look above). Reliable sources state that it was an anti-trans rally and therefore so do we. As per your claim that the article states that she organised the rally, that is simply not the case. The article states that she spoke at the rally which was organised by Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull. Perhaps you should go read the relevant sections again. Regards, TarnishedPath^talk 03:47, 10 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What are your so called “reliable sources”? My sources were the Australian Womens Forum Moira Deeming herself in an e mail and Sky News. Or are only left leaning “sources” allowed? I thought Wikipedia was supposed to allow all points of view? The rally was titled “Let Women Speak” like Ms Gains has, with the physical injustices in woman's sports. Do biological women now have no voice?? Yes it was opposed to allowing any biological man who simply states he’s now a woman, to enter change rooms and toilets where young biological girls are present. It’s an opposite view… that’s not illegal. Skyfox Gazelle (talk) 06:50, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Expect this comment to be the subject of a noticeboard report when I have time later tonight. TarnishedPath^talk 07:24, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I thought Wikipedia was supposed to allow all points of view? This is a fundamental misconception about Wikipedia. Wikipedia reports on what reliable sources have to say on a topic; if they don't report a particular point of view then Wikipedia does not either.

Of the sources you mention: what you claim Moira Deeming said in a private email is totally unverifiable; even if she has made a public statement she is clearly not independent and if independent reliable sources contradict her then we are going to go with them. I'm not sure who you mean by "Australian Womens Forum": if you are referring to Women's Forum Australia then they are a campaign group mostly known apparently for their own anti-trans campaigning. Why should they be considered a reliable source here? Finally, Sky News Australia was discussed at the Reliable Sources Noticeboard in 2022. The conclusion was that their opinion pieces are unreliable, and as for their news content: "it would be prudent to exercise caution when citing Sky News AU, and it probably should not be used to substantiate exceptional claims". None of this outweighs the mainstream coverage which unequivocally characterises the rally as anti-trans.

If you want to make the case that we should add mention of some sources describing the rally as "for women's safety" or some other descriptor, it would really help if you were more precise about what your sources actually are: just saying "Sky News" without linking to a particular article or clip really doesn't help! Caeciliusinhorto-public (talk) 09:34, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

just passing through. it needs to be changed to be a woman's rally not this misogynist tainted talking point about it being against trans. if it's an anti-trans rally with reliable sources why isn't it labeled with any? 204.69.3.4 (talk) 22:11, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The claim of it being an "anti trans rally" is supported by three mainstream sources, The Age, The Guardian, and Channel 7, all normally regarded as very reliable. HiLo48 (talk) 03:49, 10 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

no, you need to actually cite the purpose of the rally as being called anti-trans as the reliable source. how thick can everyone be?

Trans "Everyone went to an anti-Me birthday party on Sunday!"

ABC: Omg that's terrible!

Trans "Yes! They didn't invite me at all!

ABC: This just in! Kid holds BDay party totally against Trans!

Kid: Hey, that's not fair. I didn't invite him but I'm not against him!

TarnishedPath: Too bad! ABC reported on it! 204.69.3.4 (talk) 22:16, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Echoing TarnishedPath- it is 100% correct for us to follow reliable sources, which completely contradict what you're asserting. In addition, your edits to the article were completely unsourced AND clearly written with a strong POV in a particular direction. Both of those combined mean reverting your edits was appropriate. GraziePrego (talk) 03:50, 10 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

how is "anti trans" not a strong particular direction? i didn't see that person's edits (I hate comparing the old stuff it's clunky). but you all ARE in a strong direction misinformation loop. astonishing!

the rally is for "let women speak" and you all are now speaking for them, telling them to stfu. astonishing! 204.69.3.4 (talk) 22:20, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Kinda interesting that the moment a particular account is banned, an IP pops up repeating the same points! Astonishing! GraziePrego (talk) 22:30, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

i hate to break it to you, but there are a lot of liberal women hitting "peak trans" in the past year. and I just heard about this guy's apology this morning on KJK's podcast graciously accepting the apology. See what passes for robust thinking, stringent fact reporting and honesty? "Kinda interesting... insinuation insinuation insinuation".

GraziePrego, you are protecting misinformation with "particular direction" yet your idea of a strong refutation is "kinda interesting ... insinuation insinuation insinuation."

Women are waking up. Peak trans I just found out they called it. Liberal women. Yes, they are waking up. We go all our lives being warned and SEEING the nefarious, creepy things men will do to have access to us, but we are not allowed to notice all the straight men (who have no macho aversion to wearing a dress) waltzing in to our spaces?

If you're a woman (a real one) you defend this propaganda at your own peril. If you're a real woman, when you hit peak trans, I will welcome you with a hug.

. 204.69.3.4 (talk) 22:51, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Here is what is happening, I guarantee it:

MOST men think it's their duty to protect their team at all costs, esp protecting the women from themselves. On both sides, men consistently think the best idea of "helping" is force & violence. They use the legal system, throw objects, verbally assault, bash, hit, shoot, smash, etc. Both sides do it. And both sides are the ones who end up making a good cause look violent, wrong, dishonest etc. Conservative men think bricks through windows is an ace idea. Liberal men plot to attack a Supreme Court Justice and actually wants a medal for publicly turning himself in. ALL of them assume their presence is of course wanted, needed, expected, and their right. MOST of them are offended if you don't want their "help".

The "Let Women Speak" rally got gate crashed by NeoNazi MEN. MEN! Kellie Jay Keen (I just began watching her) has repetitively side-eye commented about "podcast bros" who come to her women's events looking for soundbites and other things they can capitalize on for themselves and steal credit from women for who is actually trying to push back on trans identifying men (XY) from stealing women's rights. Because once again, they are men and assume their presence is wanted, needed, expected and their right. MOST offended if you say no thank you.

And because all the newspapers say anti-trans and neo-Nazi (due to propaganda only, not an actually sussed out fact), the liberal men "saviors" without actually citing the REAL source (LWS themselves) have decided they know the full story and they will protect all.

Fellow women, left/right whatever, you ignore all these signs at your own peril. These men will get a republican elected again just in time to strike at abortion for the 2nd fatal blow. And do these boys care? No. They don't actually know what women are fighting for. They see it all as intellectual hypotheticals and "may the best man with the best fight win".

MOST men, right AND left accuse women of exaggerating when the women's needs and rights clash with "But I want it!"

At your own peril. 204.69.3.4 (talk) 22:40, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This article is being discussed at Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard#Moira Deeming. TarnishedPath^talk 10:53, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]